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#216236 06/09/02 04:49 PM
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Hmmmmm, the plot thickens!
Very interesting...

#216237 06/10/02 09:57 PM
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Enigma and Jim on the other thread, thanks for expressing so well the trials and tribulations the island people face. These "investors" come here meeting lobster traps being pulled up on the beaches by the local fishermen, and then later want to lobby for rules that will ban fishing traps from the public view. They will come and meet small struggling mom and pop businesses, and then turn around and lobby for legislation to eliminate mom and pop businesses for one reason or another. One gets the feeling that the only folks that should be making a living should be the big businesses. Why should the small local folks have to give up their $200 a week in favor of their $200 hr? I have no problem with anyone that buys a piece of this jewel paving their property and turning their little square piece into Disneyworld if that is what they choose. I have a real problem with them trying to force everyone else to also become Disneyworld. All the world does not want a manicured and paved street. Some of us like sand streets, some of us like the fishing industry and some of us mom and pop businesses need to be nurtured to grow, not legislated out of business in the best interest of big business.
When one stands up for his local culture and local people, he is labeled racist and anti-foreigner. Yet, these same labelers, the big business owners, are the biggest racists, they are all anti-locals and anti-local culture. They are the only ones that do not seem to see it.

I have heard many of the big business owners on the island refer coldly and callously to islanders as "stupid, uneducated, etc. etc. etc." Local islanders are just stupid people that stand in the way of them and their potential fortunes. Yet, it is these same people that want you to believe that they have the best interest of the locals at heart, when the only best interest they have at heart is the fattness of their wallets.

Most of these big business owners if you spoke with them privately will tell you in no uncertain terms that they are here to make money only. They couldn't care less about the local people. I speak regarding big business owners on this island only, as there are quite a number of foreign-passport holding others that blend in quite well with the surroundings and the island people. These others are not here to line their pockets but to enjoy our way of life and are a delight to many of us islanders.

Time has shown on the neighboring island of San Pedro that if a big business owner cannot have his way on the island, he will just pack up and go to some place else easier to destroy or manipulate. Then, the locals are the only ones that will be here to pick up the pieces after they have ruined paradise. It happens all the time, especially in San Pedro. The dual passport holders pack up and leave in the middle of the night leaving the local partners to face many a dirty music

There is absolutely nothing wrong with being a local and having a different value system, education system, or cultural system than the first world, and not any single one of us should be ashamed of being who we are - poor barefoot local people on a nice island with great weather, great conversations and great neighbors and family.

Signed: deeply and passionately pro-local

#216238 06/10/02 10:39 PM
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Valentino Shal is a local Mayan man. He writes regularly in the Belize Times. His articles are very thought inspiring.

IMPRISONED BY THE WEST?
One of the things the CIA has been telling the governments of Central America is to look out for indigenous movements. Unless you can understand the world of difference an idea can make you may find it difficult to understand why.

The West, embodied by the United States of America, feeds on the idea of capitalism and the free market. It has successfully stifled the other competing ideology of Communism, which goes contrary to the interests and blocks the path of capitalism. The Communist ideology mind you is a western thought as well. So one should not deceive oneself into thinking that it might be from a different origin. It was just another Western thought.

Today the so-called developed countries of the world preach nothing but free trade and the invisible hand of the market. They even use coercive means for economically-poor and resource-rich "developing countries" to open themselves up for further exploitation. Sometimes overt methods are used but they often are sugar coated with aid money for easier swallowing. Sometimes covert methods are used and that is why we had the United States recognizing the illegitimate government of the coup in Venezuela.

There is no need to pretend that the free-market capitalism hasn't embedded itself into countries like ours. It is there and we experience it everyday. It is, we are told, what will bring to us the economic development that we are looking for. It is in our schools and all our institutions including supposedly independent Civil Society because we too believe in "democracy" now.

Well what is wrong with the obvious development that capitalism brings you ask? Nothing. Except we all now drink Coca-Cola, eat hamburgers and listen to Celine Dion and we are very much starting to look like clones. The argument is that we need to transform the resources of the world into goods and have consumers buy them so that we can generate wealth. It is also the best system that generates and distributes wealth we are told. That can be true if we close our eyes to the increasing human poverty and suffering worldwide.

Back to the ideology part now. Free market capitalism is promoted tied to democracy. We really have to start questioning whether those two things go together because democracy today is practiced by governments of the people paid for by big businesses. We are told that we need democracy nonetheless because it empowers people to have a say in affairs of the nation. There is freedom of speech, freedom of expression, etc. People are free to assemble and to form whatever groups or parties they wish. This is what Communism doesn't give you because it is the state that runs the lives of the people and there is only one party. Dissent is not allowed. You are therefore not free.

Communism is dead so we don't need to worry about ever being deprived of our freedom. There is only one country in this hemisphere that is Communist and that is Cuba. Every single other country has gone the way of democracy and free trade. So now all we have to do is enjoy our western capitalist freedom where you are a consumer while you are still in the womb all the way to your funeral. Now we are talking business right?

Our lives, our experiences and every single activity we engage in is prescribed by our belief in this ideology. No dissent is allowed. There is pressure on you to avoid the slightest deviation. There are lifelong consequences if you dare to go any other way. You don't want to go to the "educational institution" then no job and no future for you. You don't want to "modernize" then no "development" for you. The rate at which this ideology is permeating every crevice of our society pretty soon we will end up with a one party system because we are not allowed any other option to choose from. We already are not free to look any other direction. We were told that this is what communism brings but it seems like capitalism brings the same thing too. Why have we been thinking that they were different when they come from the same source?

There are recent civilizations that were built not necessarily using these ideologies and there are those from that immediate past who are still with us. You find them in every part of the world. They are the indigenous people. They have an ideology but what they have cannot be considered an option by the west because it will ruin or interrupt the status quo. People today it seems exercise their minds within given parameters and live their lives imprisoned by the west. No wonder the indigenous peoples movement are being monitored. We don't want to take over the world however, we just want to live free. Think about it.

#216239 06/11/02 01:01 PM
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Interesting reading. Note that you became a consumer when you began consuming as a young baby. No one made you do it.It is the natural way of not starving.
Under democracy you also choose your own schooling including home schooling or none at all.
If you believe no dissent is allowed then you have't read many of these posts! Note that your own post is completly dissent and seems OK.
These ideas do all have the same source.They come from the thousands of years of indigenous peoples trying out every idea in sight. Most settled on pure free market trade like the Maya. These ideas began to be written down thousands of years ago long before the term "west" was invented. In a free market system you may barter, spend money or practice communism as we did as commune hippies in Colorado USA. No one cared as long as people choose it for themselves. That is the meaning of the "Free" in Free Market Capitalism. Communism was rejected because it was a dictator system and was not free. Dictator systems produce clones because you have no choice. Free systems allow you to respond to ads,ignore them, become a clone or not, grow your hair or write comments like these. Westerners are descended from indigenous peoples and are promoting the free market ideas our forebears and yours invented a long long time ago.
Pressuring folks to conform to a standard is another idea brought down from our indigenous roots. Societies have done this for thousands of years and is usually the reason cultures have survived with their traditions intact.

#216240 06/12/02 01:52 PM
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When the Europeans encountered the inhabitants of the new world, they didn't just steam roll over them. While the Europeans ended up dominating the Indians,
the cultural diffusion and exchange of products and ideas flowed both ways. In addition to the material wealth the Europeans extracted from the new world,
they also extracted some new ideas and ways of thinking. For example, the level of personal freedom that the Indians enjoyed was far greater than what the Europeans were themselves accustomed to back in the
old world. Societies of the new world were far less hierarchical in structure. These encounters with the Indians influenced the way European philosophers
developed the concept of freedom and the way it is practiced in America today. There are a myriad of other lessons and ideas that the Indians imparted to
their conquerors that shaped the world in which we live today, despite the fact that the Europeans were not at all interested in getting to know the peoples they encountered and much less interested in thier ideas. Instead, the Europeans were hell bent on conquering the new world and grabbing as much land and wealth as they possibly could. This wealth grabbing
frenzy partly led to the industrial revolution and the rise of capitalism; but it may be no coincidence at all that the French and British empires, who benefitted the most from the material extractions from
the new world, are no longer the world superpowers they once were. Perhaps they should have paused to listen to some of the ideas because it may be no coincidence at all that it is America, the nation most
influenced by the culture of new worlds inhabitants and their concept and practice of personal freedom, that stands today as the world's only remaining superpower.

Unfortunately, America's desire for wealth and power is as strong and as blinding as that of its European forefathers during thier conquering days. And this desire for ever more material wealth is spreading
modernity throughout the rest of the world so that it can expand America's customer base and feed its desire for profits. Most societies are buying into it because the benefits they stand to gain are tangible
and indeed very attractive. Yet, the indigenous voices are once again trying to teach us a lesson and remind us that no level of material wealth is as important as maintaining our personal freedoms. The
modern lifestyle may actually be a trap that will eventually choke us or convert us into zombies mindlessly in pursuit of the good life. Val's article may not have been greatly written, but I think his message is strong enough. All this talk about free
trade and democracy is for what? So a few people can get rich selling all kinds of products we don't really need to be happy. So a few people can amass ridiculously extreme wealth while the majority are
left chasing after their SUVs and designer clothing?
All kinds of products are being developed to make our lives better, from Botox to Viagra. But do they make our lives more meaningful and happy? A few may help
us to live longer but for what? Meanwhile, the only voice that cries out in rejection of this sugar coated mental slavery system, is that of the indigenous peoples who prefer to live their lives more in harmony
with their natural environment; but their voices are once again being stifled because it does not align with the great desire to generate wealth that is held by the powers that be. So, the idea is to just steam-roll over them if they won't join the program.

But perhaps it would be worthwhile to pause and listen for a minute and not simply dismiss them as a primitive society. Has history taught us nothing?

#216241 06/12/02 03:10 PM
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History always teaches us something, problem is most of us never take it to heart and govern ourselves differently according to those teachings.
As they say...."You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink"
Thus history repeats itself, over and over and over again.

In 20 years, others will be rehashing the same things we are talking about now.
It's human nature.

What can we do about it? Hmmmm..
I think the real question is, Is there really anything you can do?

I say make the most of every day, as if it's your last, and always do the right thing.
That should give you a clear conscience to sleep on and peace in your old age.

Have a wonderful Belizean day! :-)

#216242 06/12/02 06:05 PM
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Indiginous peoples continue to procreate. This means more people with less land to live off. The land is overused and becomes useless. Eventually overpopulation leaves everyone wanting.

#216243 06/12/02 09:54 PM
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every race and type of people procreates, not just indigenous peoples. to say that indigenous people procreate is such a stupid comment. every race and type of people on this earth is responsible for the amount of humans that now inhabit this earth. it is our collective responsibility why the population is what it is today. what is it exactly that you are trying to say, thinker? that indigenous peoples shouldn't procreate and only the others (meaning your race and kind of people)? sheesh!

besides, no one is guiltier of taking much more than their fair share of the resources of planet earth than the good ole first world countries and their inhabitants. first world people are so spoiled they see no problem with destroying something as sacred as the alaskan wilderness so that spoiled grown up first world children can run their hairdryers 24/7. and we should expect these people to support our natural way of life? yikes!

#216244 06/13/02 12:21 AM
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Your piece is well written and I agree with you so forgive me for noting that ---"Meanwhile, the only voice that cries out in rejection of this sugar coated mental slavery system, is that of the indigenous peoples who prefer to live their lives more in harmony
with their natural environment;"----
Those who are acquainted with a number of Euro and Americans have found they these first worlders are of every possible opinion and differ in most of their views from each other even within their own countries. Many millions of them cry out in rejection of this sugar coated mental slavery system,and prefer to live their lives more in harmony
with their natural environment. Attributing that voice to one group only is probably not what you meant to say.

#216245 06/13/02 09:54 AM
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LOL
Good God it's getting deep in here!
You people need to smoke a joint and chill out!

Doesn't all this rhetoric ever make you brains hurt? :-)

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