This topic is to facilitate discussion about how San Pedro's airstrip can get gov approval to receive direct international flights.

NOT AIRLINERS.

I'm talking about planes in the size range that cuurently arrive daily being able to fly direct to the island and clear customs there instead of having to fly to BZE then to the island.

Example: Cancun direct San Pedro.

I'm looking for input as to how to go about accomplishing this goal not critique of this idea.

Thanks
Thomas Blackledge
tommy@tecinfo.com
601-849-1918 US

I would be opposed. We have enough growth issues without adding that. I also would like to see a study of the impact of jet fuel on the ecosystem of the reef before even considering.

Thank you Pam for your input. But again this is not a thread for critique or opposition. Those opposed please start a different thread of opposition.

I would like this to be a positive thread instead of the usual bickering about growth.

Thanks for your consideration.

The jet fuel storage (or lack thereof) is one of the main reasons why international flights are not received on the island. Also there is no available hanger space. The length of the runway is quite prohibitive. We don't have a control tower. The cross winds are tricky most of the year. The list does go on.

But if you want to make a plea then you should direct it to the Minister of Civil Aviation - Manuel Heredia Jr.

You need neither jet fuel storage nor hanger space to accept international arrivals from Cancun. The planes can be kept in Cancun overnight and have a morning and evening round trip to San Pedro.

Honestly, the flights probably wouldn't need to be much bigger than the puddle jumpers making the trip now to be profitable. Hense, I don't believe the cross winds would be any more of an issue than they are now.

Would be very well received I think.

Are small commercial aircraft allowed to take off with a tail wind like the domestic airlines do here in Belize? Is the rule about the elementary school at the end of the airstrip (thus taking off with a tailwind) an urban legend or does it hold merit?

SIN

Personally I would love to fly direct to Cancun/Playa.

Tom - A good start might be some educated dialogue with Steve Schulte (Tropic Air, CEO I believe is his title).
He is also the new San Pedro Chamber of Commerce VP and is in the process of working towards a new Tropic Air terminal in SP. Nice guy and might be able to discuss this matter with you privately.
Just a thought. (No opinion) His e-mail is: steve@tropicair.com
Pam

Tom, interesting idea! If you do have a "private" conversation, please keep us posted!

The airstrip won't handle many more flights without being upgraded.
The Mexican Government has made flights between Belize and Mexico "difficult".
The drug traffic is easier to keep an eye on with all arriving aircraft coming in to Goldson Intl. The King Air on Northern Highway is an example of ATC keeping an eye on things.
You can land some bigger aircraft but there is no where to park and little turn around room. Our twin otter impacts operations by adding 8 or 9 take offs during high season and parking it by the east fence.
The last time we flew over Basil Jones airstrip it was very overgrown. Someone should make it into a viable airstrip.

the reason why they all takeoff with for the most part a tailwind is because:
#1 They would have to taxi to the other end of the runway therefore delaying other departing flights, and incoming flights.
#2 there is enough available runway to takeoff with a tail wind
#3 its at the Pilots discretion how he/she wants to takeoff.

I agree I would contact Tropic/Maya and discuss this with them.
Note: theres really not enough room for a terminal big enough to house customs,immigration, with departing flights, and arriving flights.

Again people, a small customs office is all that is needed. Space is really not at issue. If anyone has ever flown to the Bahama out islands you would understand better. They have many very small strips with sometimes tiny customs offices with a single customs officer to accept/clear international arrivals.

I agree that the volume of flights is an issue, however; I don't think allowing direct to San Pedro flights will cause a dramatic increase in flights. It will just make some peoples trip more convenient and possibly more economical if a Cancun - San Pedro route can be established.

You have been advised in the next step in your quest - so please do report back when you have progress updates. You can hash the subject to death on this thread but you aren't talking to the powers that be.

Steve Schulte and Manuel Heridia Jr. are the folks to discuss this with. Steve has operated Cancun/Belize runs in the past and he has many stories to tell - but not here...

Tropic Air and Maya Island Air cannot fly to Mexico, for the same reason they cannot currently fly to Guatemala. Belize does not currently meet International Civil Aviation Organization (ICAO) and FAA safety oversight standards and is listed as a Category 2 country.

Category 2 airlines cannot fly into Category 1 countries, including Mexico, Guatemala, Costa Rica, the U.S. and so on. Honduras is a Category 2 country, which is why for a time Maya Island Air was able to fly to San Pedro Sula. (Believe that service has since been cancelled.)

--Lan Sluder

Think direct flights from Cancun to San Pedro would be a great idea, but Mexico is not cooperating much. Their rules make it very difficult to run a flight from Cancun. Lan, I think Tropic and Maya can already fly to Guatemala again; they just are not doing it at the moment.

No they do not fly to Guatemala because their status has not been upgraded. They are still category 2.

Short, where did you get that information? They would fly to Flores in a heartbeat if they could, which they can't.

--Lan Sluder

A bit condescending there Lan - two ears and one mouth for a good reason.

1. It is unlikely that there will ever be direct international flights to or from San Pedro except from very close destinations. The primary reason is the length of the runway. Cancun is 200 nautical miles from San Pedro, a relatively long distance that would require a specialized high speed commuter airliner. Since such an aircraft would necessarily be a twin engine, commercial twin engine aircraft are required to reach flying speed and lose an engine and either get airborne or come to a complete stop in a certain distance. This is called the "balance field length". San Pedro is 3000 ft long which is more than enough for anything from a twin otter (which is a short landing and take off aircraft) or any of the aircraft that take off here, but would be way too short for any of the afore mentioned high speed commercial twins. The existing ramp space is also limiting . And finally, it makes more sense for a small government to concentrate all its international flights through one airport for commercial and security reasons.

2. The category 1 or category 2 (compliant or non-compliant) ratings are issued by the American FAA and rate the countries ability to provide oversight. They do not rate the airlines nor do they care about flights that do not touch the United States. Any of the Belizean airlines could fly to Mexico by simply negotiating this right with the Mexicans.

3. Jet fuel storage is not an issue. It is essentially the same as diesel which is stored and dispensed in San Pedro with no problem. Once again space would be an issue with the airstrip.

4. The local airlines depart to the SW because in the event of an engine failure there are better emergency landing sites. It also lessens the noise pollution over the center of town.

5. Finally, Tropic and Maya's permission to fly into Guatemala was suspended by their former director of civil aviation for political and personal reasons. Tropic Air was recently approached by the new director to begin flights again. Once again, Belize's American non compliant oversite rating had nothing to do with the suspension of this service.

John E Greif III
President
Tropic Air

Lan, someone from Tropic told me that a while back, see also Jesse's post:

Runway length doesn't have to be an issue...

http://www.chelbi.net/mi17/pass_mi17.php

I'm certain Mr. Grief knows a lot more about the Belize airline business than I do, so I'll shut up.

--Lan Sluder

Jet fuel is almost the same as diesel?

"Since such an aircraft would necessarily be a twin engine, commercial twin engine aircraft are required to reach flying speed and lose an engine and either get airborne or come to a complete stop in a certain distance. This is called the "balance field length".
This term is referred to as "accelerate stop distance", and "accelerate go distance" Runway length does play a pivotal roll in whether or not small commercial airliners can land there, however this is merely FAA standards, and as we know things are always different in Belize
As for "jet fuel" it is similar qualities and you can run a diesel engine off of jet fuel,

Good info, I always thought jet fuel was a higher grade gasoline, not heavy like diesel. Always learn something new! Now that you mention it we stood behind a Maya flight taking off last week and it smelled like kerosene fumes.

that is not the experience i have had. aviation fuel, av gas, is sometimes used in gasoline engines that have increased compression, with mixed results. it is in no way a replacement for diesel fuel.

That is what I was always told before. Kids in HS used to say they would use AV gas at the drags. Or is there a difference between AV fuel and Jet fuel?

AV gas is used in internal combustion engines. The Caravans used here are turboprops, using jet (kerosene) fuel.

i pumped Jet A and av gas for 2 years, that jet fuel smell never goes away. AV GAS= is used in piston powered aircraft, it has a high octane rate, they use it in drag cars because of the high octane and it burns clean, Jet A : is similar to diesel in octane levels it has several other additives/ hydrocarbons. The caravans (Tropic Air) run off Jet A, which I believe they only refuel at the international airport??, You could throw a lit cigarette into a bucket of jet fuel and it would put the cigarette out, if you threw a cigarette in a bucket of av gas, you wouldn't be here!!!

Thanks, that makes more sense. That is why the Maya plane exhaust smelled just like kero. Diesel is almost impossible to ignite unless you add an accelerant, kero, gas etc.

Is it Mexico that doesn't want the connection Cancun/San Pedro/even BZE or Belize?

"Cancun is 200 nautical miles from San Pedro, a relatively long distance that would require a specialized high speed commuter airliner."

I am a little confused regarding this statement. The cruise speed of a Cessna Caravan is 210 knots. Making the Cancun – San Pedro air time 57 minutes. The range of a Caravan is approximately 950 nautical miles although this range would dramatically reduce the payload of the aircraft; from 3200 pounds to 1500 pounds. If you were to use a Caravan to fly Cancun too San Pedro and fueled the aircraft for 300 nautical miles the payload would be 2700 pounds (this includes a 45 minute fuel reserve which is mandatory). Because of the lower payload you would have to restrict the aircraft to 11 people instead of 14. Other than the reduction of payload I cannot see the reason a Caravan could not be used for this connection.

Maybe there is something else I am not aware of.

Engine: P&W PT6A-114 75% Cruise: 184 kts Wingspan: 51.67 ft
Horsepower: 600 shp Stall: 60 kts Length: 37.58 ft
Rec'd TBO: 3600 hrs Height: 14.17 ft
Svr Ceiling: 30000 ft Empty Wt: 3765 lbs
Rate of Climb: 1215 ft/min Gross Wt: 7300 lbs
Max Fuel: 335 gal
Takeoff (over 50 ft obstacle): 1665 ft
Landing (over 50 ft obstacle): 1550 ft
Takeoff: 970 ft
Landing: 645 ft
URL: www.cessna.com
Telephone: 800-423-7762


CESSNA 208 CARAVAN 675
Engine: P&W PT6A-114A 75% Cruise: 186 kts Wingspan: 52.08 ft
Horsepower: 675 shp Stall: 61 kts Length: 41.58 ft
Rec'd TBO: 3600 hrs Range: 1163 nm Height: 14.83 ft
Svr Ceiling: 25000 ft Empty Wt: 4535 lbs
Rate of Climb: 1115 ft/min Gross Wt: 8750 lbs
Max Fuel: 335 gal Single Eng ROC: 770 ft/min
Takeoff (over 50 ft obstacle): 2840 ft
Landing (over 50 ft obstacle): 1740 ft
Takeoff: 1575 ft
Landing: 915 ft

Your cruise speed is high. But your point is valid. A caravan could be used for this.

The problem is, the president of Tropic basically said he wasn't interested, so this issue is prob dead. If Tropic or Myan aren't interested in the Cancun route then I dought any of us will get far with a gov approval request. What's the point if the two main Belize air companies don't want the option?

"The problem is, the president of Tropic basically said he wasn't interested"

Don't know where you're getting that from, I've had conversations with Johnny about this in the past and it was something they wanted to do but it couldn't be worked out.

1. It is unlikely that there will ever be direct international flights to or from San Pedro except from very close destinations. The primary reason is the length of the runway. Cancun is 200 nautical miles from San Pedro, a relatively long distance that would require a specialized high speed commuter airliner. Since such an aircraft would necessarily be a twin engine, commercial twin engine aircraft are required to reach flying speed and lose an engine and either get airborne or come to a complete stop in a certain distance. This is called the "balance field length". San Pedro is 3000 ft long which is more than enough for anything from a twin otter (which is a short landing and take off aircraft) or any of the aircraft that take off here, but would be way too short for any of the afore mentioned high speed commercial twins. The existing ramp space is also limiting . And finally, it makes more sense for a small government to concentrate all its international flights through one airport for commercial and security reasons.

2. The category 1 or category 2 (compliant or non-compliant) ratings are issued by the American FAA and rate the countries ability to provide oversight. They do not rate the airlines nor do they care about flights that do not touch the United States. Any of the Belizean airlines could fly to Mexico by simply negotiating this right with the Mexicans.

3. Jet fuel storage is not an issue. It is essentially the same as diesel which is stored and dispensed in San Pedro with no problem. Once again space would be an issue with the airstrip.

4. The local airlines depart to the SW because in the event of an engine failure there are better emergency landing sites. It also lessens the noise pollution over the center of town.

5. Finally, Tropic and Maya's permission to fly into Guatemala was suspended by their former director of civil aviation for political and personal reasons. Tropic Air was recently approached by the new director to begin flights again. Once again, Belize's American non compliant oversite rating had nothing to do with the suspension of this service.

John E Greif III
President
Tropic Air


My transalation of this....not really interested. If my impression is wrong then let's get some support rallied and get this done.

The part that really leads me to believe there's no interest is the statement about a small gov needing to direct all international flights to one spot for security ect. Again, the Bahamas is a small gov with numerous airports of enrty spread out over numerous islands all accepting international arrivals. So I don't think the small gov excuse is very valid, nor is security a major issue.

Also the comment about needing twin eng. planes. The planes they have are capable of this route.

A boat can arrive direct to San Pedro from the US or Mexico, why can't a plane?

General Information
Flying in The Bahamas is truly simple and well within the capabilities of the lightest single-engine aircraft. Leaving the east coast of Florida, first landfall occurs at Grand Bahama Island (60nm) or Bimini (50nm). While conditions are typically VFR, GPS is the most reliable and accurate method of navigation, and GPS will get you to even the most remote of our islands.

Nassau, New Providence Island and Freeport, Grand Bahama Island are the major population centers. Flight operations are conducted within the equivalent of a U.S. TCA with radar coverage. There are approach control, tower and ground frequencies. Nassau and Freeport both offer Flight Service facilities. Nassau is the seat of Government, the hub of commerce and the busiest airport with the most airline traffic.

The other 58 airports in The Bahamas are uncontrolled and use standard procedures. All pilots monitor Common Traffic Advisory Frequency, CTAF 122.8, advising position and intentions. Left traffic patterns are used, pattern altitude is 1,000’ AGL. Outbound traffic announces before occupying runways (there are no taxiways except at Nassau and Freeport) and depart straight out or turn left, climbing above pattern altitude as soon as possible.

VFR night flying is prohibited in The Bahamas, during official sunset to sunrise. Controlled airspace requires VFR minimums of 1,500’ and 3 miles clear of clouds. The VFR minimums for uncontrolled airspace differ from the U.S. requirements of 1.000’ and one mile clear of clouds and in sight of land or water.

Mandatory Requirements
You must file a U.S. International Flight Plan before departing the U.S. and your first point of arrival in The Bahamas must be at an Airport of Entry (AOE).

Each person aboard the aircraft must have a valid passport.

Return to the U.S. requires an International Flight Plan filed to the most convenient U.S. Airport of Entry. You may advise U.S. Customs and Border Protection of arrival ETA by including the word ADCUS (Advise Customs) on your Flight Plan. In addition, you must call U.S. Customs and Border Protection and give at least one-hour notice prior to arrival.

All airplanes must have a transponder, 12" registration numbers on the plane, and one U.S. Coast Guard approved life jacket for each person. Life rafts are suggested but not required.

11 PAX = $375+usd RT per person to cover employees, taxes, landing fees, insurance, fuel and maintenance.

The Mexican Government really wants their tourists flying to Cancun on a cheap flight from North America and then moving on down to Belize with their vacation dollars.

Reaper you lost me???????????

A Caravan flight would be very expensive with just 11 passengers from Cancun. And the last thing the Mexican Gov. wants is for tourists to leave Mexico to spend $$$ in Belize.
I have many friends that have done aviation business in Mexico. In their words, "It ain't easy!". Most moved on to other locations.

MX heavily subsidizes the international air travel to lower fares and therefore encourage travel. Reaper is wondering why MX would subsidize arrivals if the $ continued on south to be spent in BZ.

You guys are assuming that all the passengers will be from Cancun to A.C. to spend $.

Some folks will travel from A.C. to Cancun to spend $.

Also what about cargo? Could goods be purchased in Cancun and flown to A.C.?

And this thread really isn't about a Cancun route. It's about San Pedro being allowed to accept international arrivals directly. A commercial Cancun or Guatemala direct route is just the conversational catalyst to try to make this happen as I'm sure the Belize gov will not make San Pedro an airport of entry just for the handfull of private aircraft that will take advantage of this if given the option.

Belize-N-Us

The cruise information of 210 knots was supplied to us by Cessna. We are a Caravan dealer in Canada.

The numbers you have quoted are at 75% cruise which is the “econo” settings but admittedly are the settings that most operators would want their pilots to use. The initial numbers you have quoted are basically irrelevant as they are for the “Baby” Caravan. ALL of the Cessna’s used from BZE to SPR are Grand Caravans. Which are the 675 horse aircraft. (Previous was 375 was a miss print).

One thing I did forget in my previous post was that the specs that Cessna use on their web are for aircraft "without" baggage pods. I don't know how much difference the pod makes but I will try to find out.

Although...as everyone in the aviation industry knows the way to make money is to utilize the aircraft to the fullest. If there were a CUN to SPR flight there is no reason not to use the aircraft for flights to and from BZE in the time between the SPR and CUN flights.

Extrapolating the prices from BZE to SPR (taking into consideration the increased landing fees in CUN and taking into consideration MANY other factors too numerous to mention) the return flight fron SPR to CUN should run around $310.00 to $350.00 per person return.

I too would be interested in this flight. It would likely save us a whack of money depending on how much the flight would be. If it were $350.00 and we could get a charter direct to CUN for $400 or $500 dollars we would pay a lot less than the $1,000 to $1,400 that we pay now!

Reaper made a several good points in that the Mexican government may be opposed for the reasons he suggested, but...I would be one that would go to CUN to shop at times. Also, I really don't know what the Mexican government would charge a Belezian airline to come into the country. It may be prohibitive!!??

Do not loose faith on your project. It may work out and if it does the Bellyaches are on me!!!!!!!

I need a Grand Caravan, no seats, no fancy avionics and a jump door please!!! Oh, for about $600,000 or less!

Got just the thing for ya, Reaper ! A little more costly, but Ive got it.

how about this question: How do you think AC will differ if these international flights from San Pedro to Cancun really do happen? in my opinion it will change this island for the worse.

This thread is discussing International flights as though it were a thought independent of the reality of San Pedro. If there was a flight to Cancun, no one would shop here and the economy would flop. We would also get all the cheap tourists who flock to Cancun coming here and not spending but using the infrastructure. Impact on San Pedro would be horrible but...... this thread is sorely for the aviation discussion. Very funny.

Agreed. Once a nice place becomes easy to access and cheap, it attracts a different flavor of tourist and the decline begins. My opinion.

Aviator is quite the Cessna dealer!
The cessna grand caravan (CE-208B) with a cargo pod has a HIGH cruise cruise speed of 174 KNOTS. NOBODY can afford the fuel burn at that speed,we used to flight plan for 150 knots. All currently produced caravans have 675 hp engines not 375. The Tropic guy is correct the caravan is uneconomical on 200 mile stage lengths.I'm no Cessna dealer but i've got 5000 hrs in caravans.

Pam, come on! "Cheap tourist flock to Cancun and don't spend any money"?

All tourist spend money.

If offered a flight to Cancun everyone would leave San Pedro and spend their money there?

I don't think these are fair or realistic statements.

Those of you opposed to this idea please start you own thread.

I want to keep this one positive, please!

I realize that some of you don't want to see anymore growth or development of AC. The evils of growth have been beat to death on this board already.

Jesse are trying to be a smart ass again?

This is twice now that you've jumped in with what seems to be an inflamatory remark directed toward me.

I asked that those opposed simply post on a new thread. I even said please.

I get sick of every topic here turning into a bitching match about growth.

BNU, I think you have too much time on your hands.

Well, I know that I said this once, but let me say it again. The original question was answered pages and pages ago. Talk to the Minister of Civil Aviation and Steve Schulte at Tropic Air. That is where you will get the serious answers to your logistical questions - if you are actually truly interested in the answers.

Looks like you might have been more interested in baiting a hook and reeling in the nonsense that you keep saying you didn't want to hear.

This is not a negative response or a bitch about growth or even a smart ass comment - this is the answer to your original question.

Why don't you report back with facts. Thanks.

BNU, I kindly ask your permisson to comment without starting a new thread.
Thank you!

The Mexican authorities have no interest what so ever in making it easy for people to fly from Cancun to San Pedro (for obvious business reasons, right or wrong).

Johnny from Tropic Air knows more than anybody on this planet about planes to Ambergris Caye; and his opinion is never one of "don't care" - on the contrary!!! his pioneer status in aviation in this country along with his dad, the late John Sr. (bless his soul) is one of the main reasons why most of us are even able to live here and make a living.
Sorry, but as one of the many people on this island who have received support and friendship from the Tropic-guys, any disrepect or questioning the motives and knowledge of the Greif legacy just pisses me off...

I personally don't think negativity helps anyone... And I think that it makes no sense at all to talk to people who have the answers to the questions we seek... And I think that international arrivals would be a horrible idea unless we also permitted international departures...

and yes, this was a smart ass post...

Just think how "convenient" it would make it for the tourists. No more nasty old convoluted flight connections and sitting in smelly airports waiting for your connection. Everybody could just fly to Cancun (from virtually anywhere) and catch a hop to SP.

The benefit to SP would be, what? More casual tourists?

How bout dredging a channel through the reef for the cruise ships?

Smart ass post, smart ass response.

bnu, I'm a little confused as to why you plan on moving here, if you are already complaining about the way things ARE IN BELIZE. Belize is not going to change to fit your U.S. view of how things should run, and if you think it is, you won't be here long. We see people move here all the time and then leave because it just isn't the way it is in the U.S. (and if it were, why the HELL would some of us want to live here? Answer: we wouldn't).

wrong thread govikes... "sucks" comments belong in the "sucks" thread.

I had my hopes, back on May 6th, that "...the issue is prob dead." maybe now?

looks like I struck a match,and am now watching it burn......

Prime Minister Dean Barrow
“Arrangements are being made to facilitate the movement of regional tourists across our borders through the implementation of a tourist card program and through the improvement of air traffic between Cancun and Belize. These measure will be accompanied by special promotions of Belize to these at hand markets.”

Improvement of air traffic between Cancun and Belize? Hmmmmmm.....the Prime Minister must not think this idea is so stupid!

PM was referring to cun-bze.
Look dude, if you want to live on an island that has direct international flights from high density airports, the world has lots of 'em.It seems the consensus on this board (island) is for quainter, more laid back tourism and lifestyle for the residents.

Who said anything about "high density"?

Read the earlier post prior to posting in order to be better informed. The Bahama islands have many "international" air strips most of which cannot accomodate "jet" traffic and would certainly not be considered "high density" even by the most radical environmentalist.

Making AC a direct arrival airport does not mean jets, large terminal buildings nor "high density" air traffic.

Although ones definition of "high density" air traffic is certainly a relative term.

The above quote from the PM was copied directly from the reporting news source. I don't read Cancun to Belize City only into that quote and I don't see how you did. How can you know exactly what he has planned? AC is the cash cow for all of Belize. Increasing tourism / arrivals / money for Belize and it's people means increasing those for AC.

"AC is the cash cow for all of Belize."

Yes, as it now is.

Yo bnu i said FROM high density.
I'm not "reading any thing into" what PM said. I ask him.

The airstrip in San Pedro is already busting at the seams. The most dangerous part of skydiving there is walking out of the SunBreeze Hotel and trying to get across the street to the plane! Adding private or Intl. flights just makes the already busy area really congested.

To fly a plane there that is not Belizean registered you have to fill out some paperwork, pay some fees and file your info with Civil Aviation. There is a company in Goldson Intl. called Aero Dispatch to help pilots with all of that. And Customs checks out your aircraft and Immigration clears you after checking your passport/visa status.

There are only a few carriers in Belize with a Belizean operating certificate to fly passengers. Tropic Air, Maya Island Air, Caribean Cargo, Javier's Flying Service and Astrum Helicopters.

Now to add arrivals with any sort of aircraft directly to SP will need some infrastructure. But the real problem is lack of space. I fly a Twin Otter there every February for the skydive event. We fly 8-10 loads per day for 10 days. It is getting harder to find a place to park our plane each year. And sometimes we sit with the props turning waiting for 10 minutes to get a slot for takeoff.

So now add our plane, a BDF Air Wing flight now and then, the regular carriers, a couple of private planes that are on the airstrip and things get really busy in February.

Why won't Intl. arrivals on SP work?
There is no taxi way to stage on, there is no fuel, there is little aircraft parking, it's really busy now, there is no Civil Aviation, ATC, Customs or Immigration on the airstrip and finally the big one...
If the powers that be want it, it may happen, but I doubt it.

Well, we have beaten this dog to death, let's move on to getting better medical care on the island first!

When Tropic acquires Maya, Basil Jones will be renamed for the country's hero aviator. Yhe GOB will recognize the opportunity and assist in the development of central america's most experienced airline. The DHT will likely beat the Cancun-Belize-Tikal route to start. Eventually the Belize airline will support the only intercontinental airport in centro america. overtake TACA's associations and affiliations and serve European holiday makers as the point of arrival. No, things will never be the same.

let's hope that fantasy stays just that

Where is the bitchin post? I need to!

Reserection.

Just to remind all of you who you are and what you said.

Comming back to haunt you!!!!!!!!!