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#286422 - 06/26/08 04:31 PM Pier Confusion?????????  
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 770
Belize-N-Us Offline
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Belize-N-Us  Offline
"Secondly, Ambergris Caye has seen a major proliferation of piers on the east side of the island. Private piers are rented out to businesses and generate a monthly income which will eventually pay off the pier itself in a year’s time. If a public pier is constructed and if it provides all the pertinent and necessary amenities, then the demand for the construction of private piers is lessened."

The above was copied from a report in The San Pedro Sun.

I thought all piers were built on the queens beach and therefore are all considered public. This report states that "private" piers are "rented" to pay for themselves.

I know this topic has been discussed here before and my impression was the builder / "owner" has no right to limit access to the pier from 6 AM to 6 PM. How can a pier then be considered private and "for rent"?

This topic is important to me right now as I'm currently building a pier.

Can anyone provide the correct / lawful answer to the private vs public pier issue?

Thank you


Future full time Belizeans
Tommy & Sonia Blackledge
Magee, MS 601-849-1918
#286425 - 06/26/08 06:14 PM Re: Pier Confusion????????? [Re: Belize-N-Us]  
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,731
elbert Offline
elbert  Offline
"I thought all piers were built on the queens beach and therefore are all considered public."
They are.

To answer your question 'Can Anyone provide the correct/lawful answer to the private vs public pier issue'....No!
You can go to http://www.belizelaw.org/
read it and decide for yourself, but other than that its all horse manure.
You'll hear anything and everything. Just do what you want and let whom ever objects prove it.


The Dive Shops Daily Blog
http://scubalessonsbelize.blogspot.com/
#286443 - 06/26/08 09:19 PM Re: Pier Confusion????????? [Re: elbert]  
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 166
RathaBnBelize Offline
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RathaBnBelize  Offline
Elbert ....do you happen to know what chapter in the laws deal with piers...or are you going to make me look for it myself? smile

#286469 - 06/27/08 08:53 AM Re: Pier Confusion????????? [Re: RathaBnBelize]  
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 770
Belize-N-Us Offline
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Belize-N-Us  Offline
Here are a few issues that I find confusing.

1. How can an individual charge / collect rent on a pier if it is public property?
Example: charging for boat docking long term.

2. If a pier is public property then a lease agreement would not be a legal document and therefore not enforceable in court?
Example: failure to pay rent.

3. Who is liable for personal injuries which may occur on this "public" property, the queen who "owns" it or the pier builder who built it or paid for it to be constructed?
Example: structural overload. The builder can't legally limit access. A large group of people gather on the pier and cause a structural overload colapse. Several people are injured and maybe someone dies as a result. Who is legally liable in court?

4. A pier builder decides to teach yoga classes on "their" papala pier. A local wants to fish, drink beer, belch and smoke from the same pier at the time yoga class is in session. Does this "owner" who spent tens of thousands of dollars constructing this pier really have no legal right to have this beer belching, cigar smoking fisherman removed from this pier?

To me it makes more sense that the actual pier structure would be "owned" by the builder. The water under the pier would be "public" and the sand in front of the pier would also be public.

Government (any government not just Belize) rules don't always make sense though do they?


Future full time Belizeans
Tommy & Sonia Blackledge
Magee, MS 601-849-1918
#286473 - 06/27/08 09:50 AM Re: Pier Confusion????????? [Re: Belize-N-Us]  
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 770
Belize-N-Us Offline
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Belize-N-Us  Offline
Went to the web site. I cannot find the laws regarding piers. Searched key words pier, dock, boat, queen's, beach.....nothing.

I did find the medical practitioner's registration act. Thanks for that!


Future full time Belizeans
Tommy & Sonia Blackledge
Magee, MS 601-849-1918
#286474 - 06/27/08 10:05 AM Re: Pier Confusion????????? [Re: Belize-N-Us]  
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 314
Northern Canuck Offline
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Northern Canuck  Offline
In Canada it is called 'Crown Land'. Maybe if you do a search for that instead of Queen's beach.... Here no one can build on Crown land without a permit. If you do the structure will be torn down. Crown land belongs to all citizen's of that country. I'm not sure but I think that is true for any country having the Queen as Head of State (ie the UK, Canada, Belize, Grenada, Australia, New Zealand, Barbados, Antigua etc) I would imagine in the US the equivalent would be called 'Federal Land' not sure.

#286476 - 06/27/08 10:36 AM Re: Pier Confusion????????? [Re: Northern Canuck]  
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 770
Belize-N-Us Offline
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Belize-N-Us  Offline
OK, I found what I think is it! The ruling should fall under the National Land Act. I could not find piers specifically named but below is all I could find that seemed related.



“national lands” means all lands and sea bed, other than reserved forest

(3) Reservations not exceeding sixty- six feet in width measured
from high water mark along all water frontages shall be reserved for Government or public purposes.

40. For the purpose of trespass to national lands, the word “owner” shall include any lessee, tenant or lawful occupier of such land, and any action may be taken against the trespasser by such lessee, tenant or lawful occupier in like manner as an owner.

I interpret this to mean that a legal (permit) pier builder has the same legal rights and responsibilities as an actual owner. A legal pier builder would be considered a "legal occupier" of the area and therefore considered the "owner".






Future full time Belizeans
Tommy & Sonia Blackledge
Magee, MS 601-849-1918
#286477 - 06/27/08 10:44 AM Re: Pier Confusion????????? [Re: Northern Canuck]  
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 2,430
Short Offline
Short  Offline
I have not read the law, but these are the rules I follow. A dock is not pubic but private, owned by the person who has the permit, built and paid for it. You can however not stop people from using the dock to get access to a boat or to the shore (unless this access is for commercial purposes - see the example of Island Ferry a few years back, where they suddenly started using the dock of a private residence to bring full boats of people for a large beach bar nearby). Docking on someone else's pier (without permission) can be done only on the North side from 6am - 6pm.


Live and let live
#286478 - 06/27/08 10:46 AM Re: Pier Confusion????????? [Re: Short]  
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,740
deadserious Offline
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deadserious  Offline
Originally Posted by Short
Docking on someone else's pier (without permission) can be done only on the North side from 6am - 6pm.


I thought that non-commercial use of any pier was permitted, including docking, from 6 to 6, north or south.


Now back to your regularly scheduled drivel...
#286479 - 06/27/08 10:51 AM Re: Pier Confusion????????? [Re: Short]  
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 770
Belize-N-Us Offline
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Belize-N-Us  Offline
Good "rules" but if they are not laws then they are not legally enforceable. Just trying to find the actual laws on this topic.

Example: do I need liabilty insurance to cover injuries that may occur on "my" pier to people using it without my permission?


Future full time Belizeans
Tommy & Sonia Blackledge
Magee, MS 601-849-1918
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