It was defeated by force in Iraq. It will be defeated in Afghanistan. That "five more will spring up" has always been absurd. That's not a plan for victory, it's an excuse for capitulation. Not gonna happen.

Keep dreaming Skippy.....When Osama is dead we win (1)....but that will just be a start....

I must have missed the victory? When are we pulling out?

Have you not read recent news from Iraq? Far from winning the war, the "allies" currently look like losing it.

Skippy - have you read the book I cited? Generally recognised as being one of the best analyses of what's going on there. Perhaps you disagree with his conclusions?

Yoiks! I'm wrong again.

Unless.............if there are zero lunatics, then, mathematically speaking, five can't spring up. Yeah, that's the ticket.

However, I will order and read the book as it does sound interesting. The Publisher's Weekly blurb from Amazon includes:

<Similarly, he shows that Osama bin Laden is less central to the enterprise than Western leaders think; the Islamist movement is longstanding and widespread: "This movement is growing. Osama bin Laden did not create it nor will his death or incarceration end it." As a result, he argues, the U.S. focus on bin Laden and al-Qaida is misguided and ultimately a waste of time-in fact, he says, it will only create more bin Ladens. Only a battle to "win the hearts and minds" of the Islamic world will effectively counteract the terrorist phenomenon. Unfortunately, Burke fails to address how this might be done...>

So wouldn't you know it? It always irritates me when people just point out problems but don't offer solutions. I think the only way you "win the hearts and minds" of terrorists is to accept their misguided ways or, ahem, die. Infidel.

Let's get back to the subject at hand. Who's got an M-1 Garand in collector condition they can sell me at a bargain price?

1903 A3!
P.S. Skippy the US hasn't "won" a war since 1945. Smell the coffee.

Mauser 98.

And I don't think anyone is talking about "winning the hearts and minds" of terrorists, but rather about the rest of the population of which the terrorists are a small percentage. Without the support of the large segment of the population we will never win anything.

Anyone on AC who wants to read the book can borrow the copy I have here. He doesn't have all the answers (who does?) but at least he seems to understand better than most what the questions are.

Got a numbers-matching collectible 98K. Sweet gun, but I've never fired it. Don't have a 1903, but it's on the list right after the Garand.

I'm currently reading "A Thousand Hills" by Stephen Kinzer about the genocide Rwanda experienced and how that's been turned around...talk about winning over the people.

Kinzer's an excellent read and his "Bitter Fruit" regarding the US involvement in Guatemala is enlightening. I'm waiting for his "Blood of Brothers" to learn about his take on Nicaragua's recent past. Great writer/reporter.

<end of book section>

The more I learn about terrorists--in any form--the less tolerance I have for them. Just the "terror" part doesn't sit well with me.

What an ugly mess we're in.