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#331254 - 04/02/09 10:27 PM Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials
Harvey Offline
Forgive me for letting off a little steam here; however, from the way I've been treated by the Government of Belize and its officials, I believe I've earned this right.

I came to Belize after purchasing a parcel of property near Belmopan on 1 August 2008 and brought with me a 30' motor home and a Chevrolet truck. I resided in the motor home and used the pickup for my transportation and work vehicle. They were both insured in Belize. When entering the country, I paid the required Import Deposit of more than $6,000.00 US dollars and was advised when the vehicles departed the country this deposit would be returned. One week prior to my having to depart Belize to return to the US for urgent medical care, the motor home burned to the ground, so to speak. The Belmopan Police Department under the direction of Superintendent Guzman, along with fire officials invstigated this fire. I told them I must leave several days before the day I had to go. After I leave, I find that they suddenly decided the fire to my motor home was 'Arson' and decided that I should be arrested and charged with a crime. Well, to make a long story shorter, I am in the United States, the Belmopan Police went to my property and took all of my personal property which was stored in my house there. They said they found some that was listed as burned so I must have committed a crime. Well, I had duplicate property of several things so this was foolish of them. I believe they only wanted to steal these items for their own personal use. This Superintendent Guzman refuses to answer my e-mails, telephone calls and regular mails. The Belize Government refused to refund my Deposited $6,000.00. So, I highly advise any and all persons wanting to go to Belize with personal property not to do it because the officials there will find some means to steal it. This government refuses to communicate with anybody unless you are knocking personally on their desktop. You will be cheated.
_________________________
Harvey Wood

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#331257 - 04/02/09 10:46 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Harvey]
Ernie B Offline
THSK T FK pOOR Harvey
_________________________
Gabriel, don't blow your horn until you check with me !

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#331260 - 04/02/09 11:06 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Harvey]
Short Offline
I quoted you Harvey, deleted some of the decoration and this is what I read:
Originally Posted By: Harvey
I resided in the motor home and used the pickup for my transportation and work vehicle.
...
They were both insured in Belize.
...
When entering the country, I paid the required Import Deposit of more than $6,000.00 US dollars
...
was advised when the vehicles departed the country this deposit would be returned.
...
One week prior to my having to depart Belize to return to the US for urgent medical care, the motor home burned to the ground
...
I told them I must leave several days before the day I had to go
....
the fire to my motor home was 'Arson' and decided that I should be arrested and charged with a crime.
...
I am in the United States
...
the Belmopan Police went to my property
...
they found some that was listed as burned
...
I had duplicate property of several things
...
This Superintendent Guzman refuses to answer my e-mails, telephone calls and regular mails
...
The Belize Government refused to refund my Deposited $6,000.00

I know Guzman personally from when he was from San Pedro and actually saw him recently in Belmopan. I have seen him working and more than know how his dedication. When you come back here and are innocent, you don't have anything to fear from him, he will help you out, I'm a thousand percent convinced.

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#331504 - 04/05/09 01:36 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Short]
sweetjane Offline
geez, harvey - so sorry. i know how much you were looking forward to life in belize. good luck.

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#331819 - 04/07/09 06:29 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Ernie B]
Harvey Offline
You know, Ernie, with 'supporters' such as yourself, I don't really need the government of Belize to give me a rough time. Thanks.
_________________________
Harvey Wood

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#331837 - 04/07/09 08:14 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Harvey]
Ernie B Offline
Any time, friend.
_________________________
Gabriel, don't blow your horn until you check with me !

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#333902 - 04/20/09 02:43 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Ernie B]
Harvey Offline
I don't take to certain character types calling me 'friend' loosely and prefer that you keep such utterances to yourself. One day, perhaps, we'll meet face to face and then you might consider calling me something else or suffer the consequences.
_________________________
Harvey Wood

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#333913 - 04/20/09 05:20 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Harvey]
Diane Campbell Offline
The duty part sounds pretty straightforward - you paid when you brought it in and you were to get your money back when you took it out.
You didn't take it out, ergo you don't get your money back.
That does not strike me as the least bit hinky on the part of Customs.

Doubtful that there is any provision (anywhere) for a duty refund if the goods are damaged. That part of the problem belongs to the insurance company not the customs department.

Drive out - get deposit money from customs
Burn up - get money from insurance company

Seems that would be the case anywhere.

About your problems with police, no judgements on that - sorry you are having problems!


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#333919 - 04/20/09 06:16 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Diane Campbell]
Ernie B Offline
My, my Harvey, was that a threat ?
_________________________
Gabriel, don't blow your horn until you check with me !

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#333965 - 04/21/09 12:14 AM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Ernie B]
belizeonthebeach Offline
Location: Buenos Aires, Argentina
Hmm!!!
Curious? No?
This guy is about one hiccup away from the dead zone.

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#333979 - 04/21/09 07:40 AM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: belizeonthebeach]
bywarren Offline
I have met Harvey and spoke with him in detail, in Argentina, about his move to Belize. He does not deserve the comments made here by some. He made a major commitment to move, invest and live in Belize. It is very unfortunate that it turned out the way it did. I can understand how someone who makes that kind of commitmant and effort to come to Belize would feel the way he does after all that happened.
I don't understand a comment like belizeonthebeach makes. mad




Edited by bywarren (04/21/09 08:17 AM)

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#334071 - 04/21/09 03:08 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: bywarren]
terrielinn Offline
This was quite a disheartening story to read, and I am quite sure had it been me I would be wishing to do a bit of venting as well. I am sorry your motor home burned down along with the items in it (I mean who would expect the items to be spared). To me it makes sense that you had duplicate items in your residence. The question the Belizean authorities have is are they in fact duplicates or is there a fraud. If the answer they ultimately come up with is fraud, then they have to answer the next question which is was the fire arson to initiate the fraud. Then beyond that the question of why.

It is my sincerest hope that as the investigation continues to it's end that all things are cleared up. My heart goes out to you Harvey. May your health concerns also be remedied rapidly.

As for the snide comments on this post - that's just part of life - leave them as they lie.

God Bless! heart smile

_________________________
It's great to be .....


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#334232 - 04/22/09 05:24 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: terrielinn]
Marite Offline
Hi all you people, Im Maria from Argentina and I was living till september to december in Armenia Village with Harvey Wood, and Im feeling very sad for all the things I saw some people wrote here.
I dont know what do you think about this problem but I must say that Harvey was working very hard there to make of the place that he bougth a nice and good one to live. Helped too many people giving work, food, clothes and also fun for them and their families. I think that he dont deserves that people talk in this way, specilly when dont know at all what was the real problem.
Belize is a corrupt country and this is not new,(I live in the 3erd world too and know very well what Im talking about) but also has too many good things, specially the people. Harvey and I falled in love with this country in spite all the bad things that happened to us till the first moment, and both worked very strong to live there and have a good house, so, I cant understand now why the police is doing it with him, and some pleople too.
In this moment Harvey is terrible bad with his health and it was caused for all that happened there, and is worse thinking that never will be able to return to a place that he tought will be the last one in his life.
So, I would like that you think a little more in what way you can help him in spite to make him feel worse.
I would like also to return there but not without him. I love this country and too many friends that we left, but refuse to return if he cant do it.


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#334258 - 04/22/09 08:15 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Marite]
deadserious Offline
I live in a 1st world country, and our government is corrupt as well. The difference is that the US government is covertly corrupt and in denial about the corruption. At least in Belize, you know who you need to pay off for what...
_________________________
Now back to your regularly scheduled drivel...

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#334266 - 04/22/09 09:58 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: deadserious]
sweetjane Offline
i only know harvey from the chat on this board.

he always was a gentleman. he seemed to be looking forward to moving to belize, and happy once he got there. no comment on the situation, i just wanted to say i think he seemed a nice guy and i hope he gets well and resolves everything soon.

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#334681 - 04/25/09 12:35 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Diane Campbell]
Harvey Offline
The problem which compounds the situation is that when I went to Customs I advised them of the fire and the motor home being destroyed. I advised them I would happily remove the remains of the motor home from Belize, across the border to Mexico where I could then sell it for scrap. The Customs still refused to return my deposit. So, this comment of yours does not hold water. Sorry to say.
_________________________
Harvey Wood

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#334683 - 04/25/09 12:38 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Ernie B]
Harvey Offline
No, it wasn't a threat as you are below that dignity. It was a simple comment for you to take as you see fit.
_________________________
Harvey Wood

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#334684 - 04/25/09 12:40 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: belizeonthebeach]
Harvey Offline
You might want to clarify that statement. Were you referencing yourself or another?
_________________________
Harvey Wood

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#334686 - 04/25/09 12:58 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Harvey]
Harvey Offline
Good morning to everybody wherever you are:

I came today for the first time in a few days and noted that several comments have been made regarding my original venting of hard feelings. I believe there are some very considerate and understanding people with knowledge of me, personally, and what does actually happen with the governmental agencies in Belize. I appreciate these postings, especially those of Byron and Maria, and hope they will never be disappointed in me personally.

I have made numerous attempts to contct the governmental agencies involved such as Customs and Belmopan Police Department only to be totally 'Ignored'. I made a comment about the Belmpoan Police removing my personal belongings from my property with no apparent reason other than their being desirable to the 'Officers' and were taken for their 'personal' use. The Superintendent, Guzman, took perhaps a personal offense to my comments and answered trying to defend himself agains my accusation. He failed miserably and I have his e-mail for review by anybody so desiring. To compond my accusation, a couple of weeks after the motor home was destroyed, the Belmopan Police Deprtment once again tried to make a raid on my property by returning and wanting to remove the 'Power Generator' from the remains as it was not damaged in the fire. Fortunately, my employee refused them the generator and a friend in Belize now has it in his possession for safe keeping. Yes, the government there is very honest and cooperative! Also, the insurance company which I insured the motor home as a 'structure' has refused to answer any of my correspondence. A great country I chose to become my new home.

Well, people, the bottom line is this. I am trying diligently to locate an attorney in Belize to handle my situation. Unfortunately, each so far has had reason not to accept my case. I am still working on this and will succeed because I will fight the government there, police included, and win because I have done nothing wrong.

My medical conddition si improving daily and I hope that by the end of summer here in the US,say by August or September, my health will be such that I may return to Belize and submit myself for interrogation by your Police and even appear in court to fight this corrupt situation. So, for any of you wishing to support me with your good will, I would like to hear from you again.

Thanks to you 'good guys and gals'.
_________________________
Harvey Wood

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#334703 - 04/25/09 02:20 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: terrielinn]
Harvey Offline
Thank you for your understanding and kindness. For your information, I did, indeed, have numerous duplicate items in the motor home and there are so many witnesses to this. Unfortunately, the Belmopan Police have no interest in earning the truth. There was a liting of 10 items destroyed by the fire which the Police acknowledge as I have a letter from them on a different matter stating the items. Now, they say items listed were found? No, not at all. But, they refuse to listen. I am happy there are people such as yourself with an open mind and educated enough to understand things surrounding them. Again, thnks for your words.

Harvey
_________________________
Harvey Wood

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#334709 - 04/25/09 03:33 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Harvey]
darin111 Offline
Wow, i read your story and was considering moving my family there, buying 100 acres/ranch and running my business located in the USA from a tropical rain forest paradise. Seems the more i delve into the idea, the more it sounds like a mistake. Well not a total mistake, the tropical paradise is obviously there, but the gov. seems to really dislike people from other countrys immigrating and tons of hassles/corruption etc.

At first i thought it may just be a few incidents, but the belize news even broadcasts the corruption. Are there similar countrys located in South America that do not have these type of problems and welcome retiring peoples from abroad?


Edited by darin111 (04/25/09 03:34 PM)

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#334712 - 04/25/09 03:48 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: darin111]
SimonB Offline
You should realize that one person's misadventure doesn't define everyone elses experience.

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#334713 - 04/25/09 04:17 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: SimonB]
darin111 Offline
I understand, im evaluating a bunch of incidents not just Harvys. I received some great advice and great experiences as well.

Its concerning that a person can buy property and fear entering the country to enjoy it because of an unfortunate incident as a motorhome fire. It seems Harvey could actualy go to jail for a police investigation thats most likely just an inexperienced policeman dreaming up a theory. Theres not even dna testing in the whole country yet a tiny local police investigation with virtualy no resources whatsoever probably with no forensic testing ability or testing equipment can determine a motorhome fire. Motorhomes/trailers burn up so often here in the USA its the most common insurance claim on recreational vehicles.


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#334730 - 04/25/09 08:09 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Harvey]
Ernie B Offline
grin
_________________________
Gabriel, don't blow your horn until you check with me !

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#334775 - 04/26/09 01:20 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: darin111]
Harvey Offline
You appear to be an educated, considerate and involved individual in live. What you said is very true, in my case at least. I have bitter memories of my expreiences with the Belize government and local self-important officials. It seems that there whenever a minor official is granted some authority it goes straight to his head giving him believe he is a 'minor' God with unexcelled powers. I came in contact with more of this type than you could possibly believe, from Customs minor-officials at the boarders to minor Police officers. My motor home did burn, it was not arson, the police removed 'all' of my personal property from my home there saying it was declared destroyed in the fire, even though I had duplicate items verifiable by many friends and business associates there. None of these items were of consequence as they were not insured nor claimed for any form of reinbursement. My 'personal' opinion is simply that the officers saw all of my personal effects and wanted them for their personal use. Now, if I am mistaken, where are my personal effects, why does the Police Deprtment refuse to furnish me with an inventory of what they removed and why did they return two weeks later and try to remove the gasoline generator from the vehicle that was not destroyed by fire? Too many questions and no answers. So, please, do not enter Belize believing you will find a tropical paradise with all the comforts and safety you desire. The government from the top to the very bottom is more than just corrupt it is deplorablee. If you shake hands with anybody from any department of the governent there, please, count your fingers twice and make certain you still have all rings and your watch. They will steal you blind and then kick your seeing-eye dog to death.
_________________________
Harvey Wood

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#334783 - 04/26/09 02:07 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Harvey]
Amanda Syme Offline
okay harvey - you have had your say - over and over and over again. enough already. yes it is a sad story and I sympathize with your plight.

good luck in your new life. People considering moving to Belize should be aware that there are good people and bad people here. And sometimes people have good luck and sometimes they are not so lucky.

Everybody gets to tell his story and others make comments. Then life must go on.

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#334785 - 04/26/09 02:10 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: darin111]
Amanda Syme Offline
Originally Posted By: darin111


At first i thought it may just be a few incidents, but the belize news even broadcasts the corruption. Are there similar countrys located in South America that do not have these type of problems and welcome retiring peoples from abroad?


darin111 - I hate to be the one to tell you this but, there is corruption in every country in the world - yes this includes all of central and south america - oh and north america too.

Do you research, come down for an extended visit(6 months minimum) - and if it feels right buy your land and move the family down. 6 months gives you a chance to make friends and start learning the ropes. You might end up choosing a different area of the country. But no amount of listening to other people's stories is going to fully prepare you and your unique family for this move.

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#334809 - 04/26/09 08:36 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Amanda Syme]
darin111 Offline
Hi Amanda,

Thanks for the reply. Im not new to crime/corruption in other countrys. Been to europe, Russia, all over Mexico. Usualy there is a higharchy dealing with most legal systems. Hopefully it is true with Belize and you can get into touch with a higher authority to work out problems.

As i do with all my endeavors, i like to get the local oppinions and news. Im 40 years old married and 2 children, 16 and 9 months. Obviously there not many people in their right mind that would advise us relocating to Belize City as the information i gather it may be possibly the most dangerous place on the planet minus a few African murder zones.

As im considering the Toledo district, theres not much information anywhere as the area is hardly populated as well as probably a real inaccurate census.

People on this forum have differnt views/experiences, some like it some dont. Some are nice, some not and some seem down right hostile when they hear about someones misfortunes that happend in Belize and possibly happy to see others misfortunes. Rather then talk about it and possibly improve the situation it appears some expatriots in Belize have an attitude of "dont like it get the "F" out!". In the USA when somebody has a misfortune there are also the few who react the same way, we call them jackass's.

Its actualy shocking to read some of the things people say to others who had misfortunes in their relocation to Belize. Seems the expatriot community is decisivly different the youd expect.

I live in Califonia and tour throughout the USA regularly and it doesnt even enter my mind when i walk around i could get mugged/ murdered and my family raped, but i dont walk arounf Los Angeles either.

My basic concern is if i bought 100 or so acres in the toledo district and retire can my children walk to town/school like my children do here in the USA without feeling a bandit will drag them into the bush or a machete weilding drug addict trying to hack my arm off for a dollar? Will i have to carry a weapon everywhere i go?

Belize seems to be a mystery to even people who live there. Im not understanding how there can be a murder almost everyday with a population of a few hundred thousand. Somethings not making sence, is the population shrinking or do more people die there then being born? and how can the average age in Belize be 19-20 years old?

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#334814 - 04/26/09 10:02 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: darin111]
dabunk Offline
Your children will be fine as will you. First thing is if you buy 100 acres you will be way outside of town to begin with. Depending on the village, there may be a school, but it will be way below your childrens current level. We moved here with 3 out of 4 of our kids. Our oldest was 20 at the time and stayed in the US.

Our youngest was 4 when she arrived and 6 months after being here was molested by our neighbors son. Attitudes here are not the same as the US, many consider women second class citizens to be used. We learned the hard way, and keep a close eye on our girls. But now that we are part of the community here everyone watches out for my children just as much as they watch out for their own.

There are estimated 300,000 people living in Belize with estimates of 150,000 in the US. I am a card carryng NRA member,love to target shoot and hunt, so moving here and having to get rid of all my guns was very hard, but I have as yet ever felt the need for carrying any weapon.

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#334815 - 04/26/09 10:05 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: darin111]
Amanda Syme Offline
As I mentioned, you really need to try an extended visit to Toledo, live there a while, get to know the area, the culture and make some friends. See what your assessment is of the area.

I am quite surprised at the statistics you are mentioning. Here on the island we certainly have significantly more births than deaths - of course this is just one small island - a tiny microcosm of the entire nation.

For info on Toledo you would be much better off visiting a Belize message board forum where there are more people that have experienced life in those areas.

Ambergris Caye is absolutely nothing like the Toledo district.

It is probably time to come for a visit so that you can formulate your own opinions based on facts - not info you are are gathering from an anonymous message board.

Good luck, enjoy and report back.

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#334816 - 04/26/09 10:28 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: dabunk]
darin111 Offline
Originally Posted By: dabunk

There are estimated 300,000 people living in Belize with estimates of 150,000 in the US. I am a card carryng NRA member,love to target shoot and hunt, so moving here and having to get rid of all my guns was very hard, but I have as yet ever felt the need for carrying any weapon.


Thanks for the information!

What do you mean "150,000 in the US" ?

I feel for you as im an NRA member as well. Seperation from firearms, very difficult decision as they are dear to me and my beliefs. I do feel vulnerable without them as i know the criminals do have them. Sorry to hear about your daughter, is there a criminal legal system to handle such things or is it something an individual deals with?


Edited by darin111 (04/26/09 10:40 PM)

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#334820 - 04/26/09 10:40 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Amanda Syme]
darin111 Offline
Originally Posted By: Amanda Syme
As I mentioned, you really need to try an extended visit to Toledo, live there a while, get to know the area, the culture and make some friends. See what your assessment is of the area.

I am quite surprised at the statistics you are mentioning. Here on the island we certainly have significantly more births than deaths - of course this is just one small island - a tiny microcosm of the entire nation.

For info on Toledo you would be much better off visiting a Belize message board forum where there are more people that have experienced life in those areas.

Ambergris Caye is absolutely nothing like the Toledo district.

It is probably time to come for a visit so that you can formulate your own opinions based on facts - not info you are are gathering from an anonymous message board.

Good luck, enjoy and report back.


Thank you for the information,

I too was surprized with those statistics, had to look at many sources because didnt belive they were possible, but it appears they are accurate, even according to the Belize government. Whats even more odd is the population really hasnt increased in a decade according to the census? Also read from many sources that the island communities are completely different then the mainland as you stated and the quality of live cant be compared as the mainland seems to have some really depressing sights.

Where is the belize message board?

Thanks again

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#334824 - 04/26/09 11:55 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: darin111]
weile Offline
Hi Darin111,

Having lived in Belize for 8+ years (moved back to my home turf six months ago), I think that I might have a few experiences and viewpoints to share.

Life in San Pedro is indeed very different from life in Toledo. You will have to come and spend quite some time in both places before you decide, I would think.

Belize is a true melting pot (cultural, racial, religious, etc.), and nowhere on this planet will one find as tolerant and welcoming a place as Belize. I can say this from experience, having lived in six very different countries and having traveled for work or leisure all over the planet to more countries than I care to mention.

It is very true that Belize has a lot of corruption and power abuse going on, and that this is happening at all levels of administration. Unfortunately this has everything to do with the greedy and power-hungry part of human nature, which is sadly present everywhere people live, and has got nothing to do with the people of Belize in general.

The main difference between corruption in Belize and i.e. the U.S., the U.K. or mainland Europe, is that in Belize this is pretty much out in the open, exposed to a point where it becomes funny-sad, while it, in the other places mentioned, is mostly happening among the highest placed officials and the wealthier few.

While there is absolutely no excuse for corruption, no matter where or who it is, you will have to understand that the relatively young, and relatively poor nation of Belize has seen more than its share of temptation from "rich gringos" who over the past 20 years have had no problem with corruption, as long as it served their own agenda. No, the guys who used to sell driver's licenses and passports; sign crazy building permits; allow people to destroy precious natural resources (unfortunately some still do) are not innocent at all, in fact they are hardcore criminals according to Belize law; but one must also understand the cultural invasion and the temptation that these people have been exposed to over the years.

I have zero respect for the elected and appointed people who take bribes and steal from the people; but on that same note I must have as little respect for the people who bribe them, and thereby exploit this beautiful country and its friendly people, be it by securing a dredging and building permit, or obtaining residency or nationality by "donating" money; vehicles; favors etc.

The solution is not to stay away from Belize out of fear from something that, in one shape or another, takes place in a lot of countries - but to avoid supporting this unfortunate situation by doing what most of us would expect from newcomers to our countries: Follow the rules, no matter what they are - and then raise your voice against which ever rule; regulation; government official etc.; or even bribe them if that's your crazy idea of how things should work, once you have legally obtained permanent residence status or citizenship. Then you will have a very good life in Belize. It worked for me, and I would not be able to tell you about one single case of me being robbed; feeling insecure; threatened or otherwise abused, even if I desperately wanted to.

In regards to safety, I can only say that if you stay out of trouble; don't do drugs; don't try to bypass laws, regulations, taxes etc. the "easy way"; don't flash your wealth - and just try to be a good neighbor and show your appreciation for Belize being one of the most immigrant friendly nations on the planet, you will have absolutely nothing to fear.

It is true that Belize has a disturbingly high murder rate, but if you stay out of drug dealing and other stupid enterprises, you will find that mostly anywhere outside the very troubled neighborhoods of Belize City will feel like Paradise and a safe haven in a big bad world. Yes, you will see break-ins and robberies, but they won't hit you if you put on you thinking hat once in a while, just like you would everywhere else.

I am not trying to make excuses for bad things going on in Belize. I personally find it disturbing and disgusting that the country does not even bother to enforce the international laws that the government itself has signed. The country has big problems and is high on the list of countries with corruption; poor animal protection; music/software/TV piracy etc., but if someone would bother making a list of the friendliest people; the most welcoming place for tourists; the least racism and the highest degree of integration of foreigners, Belize would probably be close, if not at the top of such lists.

The people of Belize are no different from other people, except from the fact that they are in a very small country, being constantly bombarded with outside influences and shady developers who work hand in hand with greedy people, while they are yet willing and able to defend their integrity and unique culture with a smile on their faces + are more welcoming and tolerant towards foreigners, and generally accept you for who you are, not what you are...

Hope this gives you a little useful info from an ex-resident who has no agenda.
... And trust me, you'd be just fine without NRA and your precious guns here. I protected my place with a mag-lite, and I never had to use it for anything but finding my way back home from the beach bar.

Good luck, what ever you decide to do.

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#334825 - 04/27/09 12:18 AM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: weile]
reaper Offline
I have had numerous dealings with the government, customs, the police and the military of Belize over the past seven years. I have had to be very patient at times, remembering that Belize is not the USA and that things are done a bit different. For the most part everything has always worked out in my favor and I have been treated very well. I find that you just need to keep smiling and being nice, even when the score isn't in your favor. And I wouldn't think posting here would do anything to help my cause the few times I have had difficulties.
And as far as safety, I can't speak for the Toledo district but I think San Pedro is pretty safe and tame compared to California.
I also have walked through Belize City by myself during the day with no hassle. And I really enjoy some of the restaurants there also, day or night.


Hi Ebbe, nice to see you still hanging out here with us!

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#334826 - 04/27/09 12:29 AM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: reaper]
weile Offline
'Cause I am Reaper-boy. Will be back some day too, before you know it...
When're you gonna jump out of a perfectly well functioning plane over Spain, you crazy dude? See ya.

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#334842 - 04/27/09 08:53 AM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: weile]
Amanda Syme Offline
weile - you hit the nail right on the head in a concise and succinct manner. That is a very accurate description of Belize.

Say hi to Marianne.

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#334860 - 04/27/09 10:33 AM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Amanda Syme]
dabunk Offline
Many Belizeans emigrate to the US when possible for better opportunities, jobs, etc. Many of the young leave Belize for the US to attend school/college. So much of the population increase in Belize moves to other countries. You can speak to almost any Belizean family and find they have many relatives living in the US

As far as my daughter, I dealt with the family and the father myself. He was an honorable man and was horrified at what his son had done. The boy recieved a beating he will not ever forget. His family loved him through it and we remain friends to this day. There is a criminal justice system to deal with these problems, but I knew he would have been way more damaged by being in the prison system in Belize. And part we learned is the differences of Belizean thinking versus US. In Belize most families live in one big room. In this case the young boy slept in the same bed as his mom and dad. In his mind this was normal as he saw his parents doing it all the time. Children here are exposed to much more than our chidren at a very early age.

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#334878 - 04/27/09 12:49 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: dabunk]
darin111 Offline
Originally Posted By: dabunk
Many Belizeans emigrate to the US when possible for better opportunities, jobs, etc. Many of the young leave Belize for the US to attend school/college. So much of the population increase in Belize moves to other countries. You can speak to almost any Belizean family and find they have many relatives living in the US

As far as my daughter, I dealt with the family and the father myself. He was an honorable man and was horrified at what his son had done. The boy recieved a beating he will not ever forget. His family loved him through it and we remain friends to this day. There is a criminal justice system to deal with these problems, but I knew he would have been way more damaged by being in the prison system in Belize. And part we learned is the differences of Belizean thinking versus US. In Belize most families live in one big room. In this case the young boy slept in the same bed as his mom and dad. In his mind this was normal as he saw his parents doing it all the time. Children here are exposed to much more than our chidren at a very early age.


Thanks for the info on a touchy situation. I gather it was a young boy, i completely understand.

If i may ask, how did your children make the adjustment from living on fast food, modern schools disneyland/amusment parks, walmarts on every corner to how you live now?

My 16 year old daughters life consists of doing basicaly nothing, sitting at friends houses and ours listening to music/t.v. etc. with no hobbies or desire to even have one smile The older she gets the less desire to do anything and it makes me double interested to get her out of this type of living. Shes afraid to make the leap but there is still a spark in her thats wants to go and see whats its like.

I plan to have many acres start a hobby farm, run my USA business and get back to doing the things we did when my daughter was younger like go hiking, dirtbikes, outdoors, just be more adventurist in general. My 8 month old boy i figure will be fine with the change in lifestyle. In the next couple months we will take a vacation for a week in Belize, id like to stay longer but cant do to my business.

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#334886 - 04/27/09 01:43 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: weile]
darin111 Offline
Originally Posted By: weile
Hi Darin111,

Having lived in Belize for 8+ years (moved back to my home turf six months ago), I think that I might have a few experiences and viewpoints to share.

Life in San Pedro is indeed very different from life in Toledo. You will have to come and spend quite some time in both places before you decide, I would think.

Belize is a true melting pot (cultural, racial, religious, etc.), and nowhere on this planet will one find as tolerant and welcoming a place as Belize. I can say this from experience, having lived in six very different countries and having traveled for work or leisure all over the planet to more countries than I care to mention.

It is very true that Belize has a lot of corruption and power abuse going on, and that this is happening at all levels of administration. Unfortunately this has everything to do with the greedy and power-hungry part of human nature, which is sadly present everywhere people live, and has got nothing to do with the people of Belize in general.

The main difference between corruption in Belize and i.e. the U.S., the U.K. or mainland Europe, is that in Belize this is pretty much out in the open, exposed to a point where it becomes funny-sad, while it, in the other places mentioned, is mostly happening among the highest placed officials and the wealthier few.

While there is absolutely no excuse for corruption, no matter where or who it is, you will have to understand that the relatively young, and relatively poor nation of Belize has seen more than its share of temptation from "rich gringos" who over the past 20 years have had no problem with corruption, as long as it served their own agenda. No, the guys who used to sell driver's licenses and passports; sign crazy building permits; allow people to destroy precious natural resources (unfortunately some still do) are not innocent at all, in fact they are hardcore criminals according to Belize law; but one must also understand the cultural invasion and the temptation that these people have been exposed to over the years.

I have zero respect for the elected and appointed people who take bribes and steal from the people; but on that same note I must have as little respect for the people who bribe them, and thereby exploit this beautiful country and its friendly people, be it by securing a dredging and building permit, or obtaining residency or nationality by "donating" money; vehicles; favors etc.

The solution is not to stay away from Belize out of fear from something that, in one shape or another, takes place in a lot of countries - but to avoid supporting this unfortunate situation by doing what most of us would expect from newcomers to our countries: Follow the rules, no matter what they are - and then raise your voice against which ever rule; regulation; government official etc.; or even bribe them if that's your crazy idea of how things should work, once you have legally obtained permanent residence status or citizenship. Then you will have a very good life in Belize. It worked for me, and I would not be able to tell you about one single case of me being robbed; feeling insecure; threatened or otherwise abused, even if I desperately wanted to.

In regards to safety, I can only say that if you stay out of trouble; don't do drugs; don't try to bypass laws, regulations, taxes etc. the "easy way"; don't flash your wealth - and just try to be a good neighbor and show your appreciation for Belize being one of the most immigrant friendly nations on the planet, you will have absolutely nothing to fear.

It is true that Belize has a disturbingly high murder rate, but if you stay out of drug dealing and other stupid enterprises, you will find that mostly anywhere outside the very troubled neighborhoods of Belize City will feel like Paradise and a safe haven in a big bad world. Yes, you will see break-ins and robberies, but they won't hit you if you put on you thinking hat once in a while, just like you would everywhere else.

I am not trying to make excuses for bad things going on in Belize. I personally find it disturbing and disgusting that the country does not even bother to enforce the international laws that the government itself has signed. The country has big problems and is high on the list of countries with corruption; poor animal protection; music/software/TV piracy etc., but if someone would bother making a list of the friendliest people; the most welcoming place for tourists; the least racism and the highest degree of integration of foreigners, Belize would probably be close, if not at the top of such lists.

The people of Belize are no different from other people, except from the fact that they are in a very small country, being constantly bombarded with outside influences and shady developers who work hand in hand with greedy people, while they are yet willing and able to defend their integrity and unique culture with a smile on their faces + are more welcoming and tolerant towards foreigners, and generally accept you for who you are, not what you are...

Hope this gives you a little useful info from an ex-resident who has no agenda.
... And trust me, you'd be just fine without NRA and your precious guns here. I protected my place with a mag-lite, and I never had to use it for anything but finding my way back home from the beach bar.

Good luck, what ever you decide to do.


Thanks for the detailed information. Very informative and makes 100% sence.

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#334925 - 04/27/09 09:23 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: darin111]
Ernie B Offline
Where on earth did Harvet go ? He hit on every female he could, then ................... went away ?
_________________________
Gabriel, don't blow your horn until you check with me !

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#334938 - 04/27/09 11:27 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Ernie B]
Amanda Syme Offline
Ernie he didn't hit on me - he got mad at me & sent a snotty email.

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#334968 - 04/28/09 09:27 AM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Amanda Syme]
Ernie B Offline
Awww Amanda, but you still did not escape his wrath.
_________________________
Gabriel, don't blow your horn until you check with me !

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#334992 - 04/28/09 11:24 AM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Ernie B]
Amanda Syme Offline
But that's okay - I get ragged on all day long - you can't keep all of the people happy all of the time.

Harvey as I said before, I am sorry about your plight. Some adventures to Belize are gloriously successful, and others end up being a true nightmare. I can tell you are a fighter and you won't let it keep you down for long. I hope you have the opportunity to enjoy many successful adventures in the future.

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#335001 - 04/28/09 01:18 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Amanda Syme]
dabunk Offline
Our son was 13 when we arrived, and it was the hardest on him. As with your daughter, he was on the computer and in the house all day long. That was part of our reasoning for coming to Belize. Everything here is outside and for the most part, sports and family oriented. It was great for him and he thriving now, hoping to attend college in the US this fall. Our daughters were 4 and 10 when we moved, there have been rough patches for them, but on the whole it has been better than living in NJ and NO SNOWWWWW!!!!!

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#335002 - 04/28/09 01:21 PM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Amanda Syme]
weile Offline
Darin & Amanda,
Glad that you read and understood my post. It was from the heart. No one should avoid Belize, actually everybody should visit at least once; and the more fortunate ones should stay :-)

Amanda, say hi to Cal...


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#335367 - 05/01/09 01:32 AM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Ernie B]
Harvey Offline
Ernie, if you believe I was 'hitting' on the females here you must be from a society where stupidity is evident. There is only one (1) female here which I showed any sincere interest in and no other. You should learn, Ernie, the difference from being outwardly friendly and curious and that of 'hitting' on all the females. Should you desire, I can assist you in this venture.
_________________________
Harvey Wood

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#335368 - 05/01/09 01:36 AM Re: Suspect Honesty of Belize Government Officials [Re: Amanda Syme]
Harvey Offline
Amanda, I did not become mad at you but did make my comment in a most blunt manner. Perhaps I was a bit too forceful and, if so, I apologize. Yes, I am very bitter about my treatment by the Belize Customs and Police Deprtment but this will be taken care of through legal channels as I have obtained legal representation. Thank you for your apparent understanding.
_________________________
Harvey Wood

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