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#424828 - 12/10/11 08:22 AM Obama endorsing gay rights movement in Belize
Marty Offline


Foreign entities continue to push smaller nations such as Belize to embrace homosexuality as normal, acceptable behaviour. We are not in the habit of reporting on foreign leaders very often, but a few weeks ago we had Britain Prime Minister David Cameron’s picture on our screen and this evening we have US President Barack Obama on our screen. Both in the same kind of story where they have in essence used their power to threaten or twist the arms of smaller, poorer nations into accepting homosexuality. Obama issued a presidential memorandum on Tuesday, saying that “Agencies engaged abroad are directed to strengthen existing efforts to effectively combat the criminalization by foreign governments of LGBT status or conduct and to expand efforts to combat discrimination, homophobia, and intolerance on the basis of LGBT status or conduct,” The memorandum says that US agencies in countries such as Belize should “vigorously advance” the promotion of gay rights. While any unnatural act with another person is on the Belizean law books as criminal, there have been no known court prosecution against such lifestyle choice as homosexuality. Even so, it is viewed by many as a “gatekeeper” law to avoid issues such as gay marriages that is itself being fought for in the United States and not without opposition either. Now the US President has in essence said that their country’s moral battle will be expanded beyond their own country as they take the battle to other nations in the Caribbean.

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#424917 - 12/11/11 08:55 AM Re: Obama endorsing gay rights movement in Belize [Re: Marty]
Dr Buzzard Offline
US unemployment rate fell some but is still at almost 9%.

$15,061,580,595,760.29. So right now each US citizen owes $48,300.18. The deficit for fiscal year 2009, which ended Sept. 30, came in at a record $1.42 trillion, more than triple the record set just last year.

The US "Misery Index" is at a 28 year high.

Pakistan and the Taliban are in open negotiations. After taking American taxpayers to the cleaners, Pakistan is withdrawing help on the war on Terror.

Army surveys show military troop morale at plumiting.

The US Povery rate has risen to it's highes in two decades. 1 in 6 people in the US now live ubder the poverty lone
.............

Yet Mr. obama is concerned about havin gay marrigaes in Belize? He should be focusing on his own domestic problems instead of playing golf and interfereing with the rest of the world, including poor countries like Belize that have not prosecuted gay acts between consenting adults, but in general do not want gay marriages either. Why is this a problem to the US? What planet did Obama come from?
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#424970 - 12/11/11 08:44 PM Re: Obama endorsing gay rights movement in Belize [Re: Marty]
Cooper Offline
It was less than a few years ago a gay couple was arrested and jailed here. It does still happen and the laws can be enforced as long as they are still laws.
I do think the laws of the world hold more terror than our homosexual laws, Women in some countries are being sent to prison because they were raped.
Obama is not asking we allow gay marraiges, get real!!! The U.S. in most States do not allow that. He is asking certain laws of discrimination, and unhumane jail terms and punishment be taken off the books. I cant figure out why he would pick this as an agenda. Another battle he cant win at this time. We are too depended on Churches here. For our childrens education and alot more. These changes will come in time, strange choice for Obama!!!!
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#424980 - 12/11/11 09:49 PM Re: Obama endorsing gay rights movement in Belize [Re: Marty]
collyk Offline
tyshepp,

I'm very sorry, but you seem extremely misinformed about this human rights issue that affects heterosexuals and homosexuals equally. No one is trying to legalise gay marriage in Belize. Belize does have a law which allows for the prosecution of anyone who participates in 'unnatural sex', which is contrary to the Belizean Constitution and to international human rights conventions that the Belize government has chosen to sign. This has nothing to do with gay marriage although the radical fundamentalists fighting to maintain this unconstitutional and antiquated law like to frighten people by claiming that it does. I'm sure we're all used to the concept of using fear and ignorance to undermine human rights and I'm sure that most of us are capable of seeing through such false and misleading propaganda. I'm not sure why you are so concerned about this particular issue when there are many other things that I'm sure you could find irritating that the USA President has done. Please don't panic, no one is asking for gay marriage to be legalised in Belize.
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#424983 - 12/11/11 10:02 PM Re: Obama endorsing gay rights movement in Belize [Re: Marty]
SimonB Offline
They put blinders on horses so things that won't hurt them won't scare them. Churches do the same for their congregations.

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#424985 - 12/11/11 10:30 PM Re: Obama endorsing gay rights movement in Belize [Re: Marty]
Cooper Offline
My husband and I both had brothers that wre homosexual. They are deceased and we loved them dearly. It is clearly a hard topic to deal with.
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#425003 - 12/12/11 09:15 AM Re: Obama endorsing gay rights movement in Belize [Re: Cooper]
GigiByte Offline
I stand beside you on this subject.I will not debate this issue because it isn't black and white for me.

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#425033 - 12/12/11 01:02 PM Re: Obama endorsing gay rights movement in Belize [Re: Marty]
Katie Valk Offline
Unibam is only asking that sex between two consenting adults is not in the same legal code as sex between a person and an animal. I think we have enough intelligence,tolerance and love in our hearts to give that dignity to our family, friends, associates and neighbors who are gay, don't you? The church has a hard time distinguishing between sex between two consenting adults and pedophilia, but we know better. PM Cameron and Obama are both asking for the same of countries they give aid to.
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#425058 - 12/12/11 05:03 PM Re: Obama endorsing gay rights movement in Belize [Re: collyk]
Dr Buzzard Offline
Originally Posted By: collyk
tyshepp,

I'm very sorry, but you seem extremely misinformed about this human rights issue that affects heterosexuals and homosexuals equally. No one is trying to legalise gay marriage in Belize. Belize does have a law which allows for the prosecution of anyone who participates in 'unnatural sex', which is contrary to the Belizean Constitution and to international human rights conventions that the Belize government has chosen to sign. This has nothing to do with gay marriage although the radical fundamentalists fighting to maintain this unconstitutional and antiquated law like to frighten people by claiming that it does. I'm sure we're all used to the concept of using fear and ignorance to undermine human rights and I'm sure that most of us are capable of seeing through such false and misleading propaganda. I'm not sure why you are so concerned about this particular issue when there are many other things that I'm sure you could find irritating that the USA President has done. Please don't panic, no one is asking for gay marriage to be legalised in Belize.


Is there any treaty or universally accepted international document that even establishes homosexuality as a human right? I happen to agree that gays should be left alone and treated equally, and all human beans should have the right to privacy -- to be left alone if not infringinging on someone else's rights.

But I think it's incredulous that Obama would pick that subject when the world is still full of gender-based abuses (did u see where the Saudies just executed a woman for "sorcery?" Religious intolerance by countries he gives buku money to, I just think he's playin a stupid and dangerous game that WILL turn many countries aainst the US, and all because he wants to pander for votes from gay rights activists in US. And yes, there are many things Obama is doing stupidly, but this is a curent event.
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#425092 - 12/13/11 12:22 AM Re: Obama endorsing gay rights movement in Belize [Re: Marty]
collyk Offline
Firstly again tyshepp, you're misinformed. This is not about homosexual rights. So I'm not exactly sure what your point is or why this is such an important issue for you. This is about the right to privacy for all adults participating in consensual sex in the privacy of their own homes within Belize.

With respect to your specific question, yes, there are international conventions on human rights that cover sexuality. Under the UN, these include:

International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights (1966) (article 2, 26)
Convention on the Rights of the Child (1989) (article 2)
Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination against Women
(CEDAW) (1981)
United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees -Since April 1993 the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR) has recognized in several Advisory Opinions that gays and lesbians qualify as members of a "particular social group" for the purposes of the 1951 Convention and the 1967 Protocol Relating to the Status of Refugees. In its publication "Protecting Refugees," the UNHCR states: "Homosexuals may be eligible for refugee status on the basis of persecution because of their membership of a particular social group. It is the policy of the UNHCR that persons facing attack, inhuman treatment, or serious discrimination because of their homosexuality, and whose governments are unable or unwilling to protect them, should be recognized as refugees." (UNHCR/PI/Q&A-UK1.PM5/Feb. 1996)

Under the ORGANIZATION OF AMERICAN STATES (OAS)

The first case on human rights and sexual orientation in the Inter-American system is that of Marta Alvarez who brought a petition against Columbia before the Inter-American Commission on Human Rights (Velasquez Rodriguez v Honduras, 1998). She was denied the right to equal treatment through the refusal of Colombian prison authorities to grant her the conjugal visits with her partner because of her sexual identity as a lesbian. Colombian law states that conjugal visits are a right for all its citizens, without regard to sexual orientation.

Organization for Security and Cooperation in Europe (OSCE)

The Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe (OSCE) is the largest regional security organization in the world with 55 participating States from Europe, Central Asia and North America. OSCE was created by the 1975 Helsinki Final Act which contained a provision to "respect … human rights and fundamental freedoms, including freedom of thought, conscience and religion, and belief", as well as "equal rights and self-determination of peoples".

The Parliamentary Assembly of the OSCE passed a declaration in Ottawa in 1995 calling on member states to provide equal protection against discrimination for all, sexual orientation being among the grounds specifically protected from discrimination.

I'm not sure why you believe that one form of discrimination deserves more attention than another. All forms of oppression and discrimination and abuse deserve equal attention and members of those vulnerable communities all deserve protection, whether they are women, men or children. It seems a bit like saying - 'Why are there all these organisations to help dogs and cats when horses suffer so much abuse?'

All of this aside, the current issue in Belize is a human rights issue affecting all adults, not a homosexual issue. As you seem very interested in this subject though, please let me refer you to some further reading

International Council on Human Rights Policy - Sexuality and Human Rights Discussion Paper
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#425097 - 12/13/11 07:55 AM Re: Obama endorsing gay rights movement in Belize [Re: Marty]
Dr Buzzard Offline
Excellant collyk. I will concede the point that some international organization have recognized alternate sexuality as a human right, and some haven't. Thanks for the additional reading material but I'm not that interested in gays. If you read my originaly reply to the story, my focus is that the US has enough problems to keep Obama busy w/o him poking his nose all over the world. As a Realist, it's easy to see he just opened the door for China to make huge inroads in the enire African continent. Not a good geo-political move. Peeps should also consider the potential unintended consequenses. I think it was in Egypt where the US supportrted a gay parade and the simple fact that the West was trying to tell them how to live enraged the population and they attacked numerous gays and gay hangouts.

I don't think Obama's plan was thought thru and I think he should focus on his domestic problems.
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#425207 - 12/14/11 08:00 AM Re: Obama endorsing gay rights movement in Belize [Re: Marty]
Marty Offline

Barrow to Obama: We don’t care!

In an interview with Amandala today, Belize Prime Minister Dean Barrow frowned upon a recent indication from United States (US) President Barack Obama last Tuesday, via a presidential memorandum, that the US has declared “combat” against countries that it may deem guilty of violence or discrimination against “lesbians, gays, bisexuals, and transgender” persons, dubbed LGBT for short—a war which could have implications for foreign aid allocations to poor nations.

Barrow told Amandala that he has not yet seen the memo himself, but he doesn’t care what it says, as the Government of Belize will not move from its stance.

The Belize Government has decided to defend the law which pronounces unnatural sex illegal and which permits a 10-year prison term for persons found guilty of sodomy. In reality, though, Belizean law enforcement authorities do not prosecute homosexuals, except in cases of rape and the molestation of minors.

As regards to the Government of Belize’s decision “to defend the law on the nation’s statute books,” said Prime Minister Barrow, if the US is saying that it will cut foreign aid to Belize, “they will have to cut off their aid,” Barrow told us.

No one can tell the Government of Belize what to do on this matter, which is an internal matter, he said.

While the Obama memo was issued out of the White House in Washington, D.C., it was directed globally, to nations including Belize, who may face repercussions in terms of foreign aid allocations from the US.

“Agencies engaged abroad are directed to strengthen existing efforts to effectively combat the criminalization by foreign governments of LGBT status or conduct and to expand efforts to combat discrimination, homophobia, and intolerance on the basis of LGBT status or conduct,” said Obama.

Prime Minister Barrow told our newspaper that there is not much that the US government gives to Belize, apart from its aid for security, which, he said, is not much and is for the US government’s self-interest, because they are worried about the drugs going to the US—which, he added, is such a huge and unforgivable consumer of the vast majority of the illicit drugs.

The US president’s memo stated that, “Under my administration, agencies engaged abroad have already begun taking action to promote the fundamental human rights of LGBT persons everywhere. Our deep commitment to advancing the human rights of all people is strengthened when we as the United States bring our tools to bear to vigorously advance this goal.”

The constitutional challenge before the Supreme Court of Belize by Caleb Orozco’s United Belize Advocacy Movement (UNIBAM) is known to have major international support.

US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton has written in her annual human rights reports on Belize for the past two years that, “The law [of Belize] does not protect sexual orientation or gender identity...”

She also mentioned UNIBAM in her report, identifying it as, “The country’s sole lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender advocacy organization...”

Clinton said that UNIBAM had reported that “continuing harassment and insults by the general public and police affected its activities; however, its members were reluctant to file complaints.”

In his memo last Tuesday, Obama declared the US’s intent to embark on “swift and meaningful U.S. responses to human rights abuses of LGBT persons abroad,” and to “vigorously advance” its goal to promote the rights of those who choose to have same-sex relations, including homosexuals and bisexuals, and those transgender persons who may decide they want to be a man today and a woman tomorrow.

PM Barrow indicated that he intends to review the Barack memo to see what other issues he has raised in the document; but Government’s decision to defend its position in local court stands, nonetheless, he indicated.

Amandala


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#425240 - 12/14/11 12:05 PM Re: Obama endorsing gay rights movement in Belize [Re: Marty]
Dr Buzzard Offline
Unintended consequences -- this is what happens when the President of the World and the Prime Minister of the World consider themselves to be superior and can wave a magic wand and everything will be fine. Lack of planning, lack of good policy, poor decision making, and lack of building a coalition vice dictating will continue to cause more problems...



Mark Canavera, RPCV Burkina Faso, has been a frequent contributor to our enewsletters and web site. This article recently appeared in the Huffington Post with a slightly different title. Not in our name: African human rights activists reject UK aid conditionality

An oft-told African proverb (whose precise culture of origin often changes with the teller) asserts that “When elephants fight, the grass suffers.” Put another way, the powerless are trampled in the clashes of mammoth decision-makers. An elephant match is currently underway between the government of the United Kingdom, which have threatened that it will consider reducing foreign aid to countries that criminalize homosexuality, and the governments of many African nations, who have stridently rebutted the threat. In the process, the “grass”–that is, Africans who support the rights of lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgender, and intersex (LGBTI) people–is suffering. But African social activists are refusing to take the trampling lying down. These are standing up and speaking out.

In October of this year, a coalition of pro-LGBTI African social activists came together, representing 51 organizations and 86 individuals from at least 19 countries in Africa, all four regions of the continent, and the African diaspora. This spontaneous coalition released a strongly worded statement that essentially rejects the UK’s proposed aid conditionality. This “not in our name” statement–by which these activists used virtual tools like listservs, emails, teleconferences, and discussion forums to reach rapid-fire consensus–argues that the UK’s decision would create backlash against LGBTI people across the continent by positioning them as scapegoats for decreases in aid revenue. The UK’s position also undermines the burgeoning LGBTI movement in Africa, the coalition claims.

“We developed this statement for three reasons,” explains Joel Gustave Nana, the Executive Director of African Men for Sexual Health and Rights and the author of the first draft of the statement. “First, we were tired of being collateral damage in international politics. Second, statements by Britain and other Northern countries affect the work that we do on a daily basis to ensure that LGBTI people are protected on the continent. And third, and perhaps most importantly, we needed to say, ‘not in our name.’ If you decide to cut aid to these countries, do not do this in our names.”

Nana explains that the UK government did not consult any African activists before taking its decision and making it public. When I asked the Office of the Prime Minister of the UK about the activists’ concerns, it replied with a statement that reiterates its reasoning: the UK hopes to ensure that its foreign aid contributes to the international strengthening of human rights. The reply does not address the concerns raised by the coalition of African activists, most notably the potential scapegoating of LGBTI people in the wake of the UK’s announcement.

For their part, the African governments that continue to criminalize homosexual acts have responded vociferously to the UK. As collated on the blog Towleroad, the governments of Uganda, Ghana and Malawi responded angrily, with a Malawian government spokesperson calling the threat “unacceptable and provocative” and a Ugandan presidential adviser describing the UK’s position as “an ex-colonial mentality.” (“We are tired of being given these lectures by people,” the adviser is reported to have told BBC Newshour.) A Ugandan newspaper reported additional reactions from Zanzibar, Tanzania, and Kenya, in which officials argued that they would rather lose foreign aid than kowtow to the Brits.

Nana believes that these government reactions were predictable and reflect the very concerns that the coalition of activists laid out in their statement. “African leaders who feel that they are being bullied to embrace values that they don’t believe in feel like this aid conditionality is an attempt to violate their sovereignty,” he says. He predicts that the UK aid conditionality will be more harmful in countries with more heavy-handed rulers, asserting, “The more authoritarian a government, the more strongly it will come out in opposing this conditionality. And the more severe the impact will be for LGBTI people.”

Issues of aid conditionality are always tricky, especially where human rights are concerned. Nana concedes that there are legitimate concerns for donor governments who want to ensure that their citizens’ tax dollars are not blindly handed over to oppressive regimes. Moreover, just last year, some Ugandan activists praised the role that some European countries’ threats of aid reductions played in combating Uganda’s infamous Anti-Homosexuality Bill, deemed odious by Barack Obama himself. Nana points out, however, that no human rights or LGBTI activists from Africa have publicly opposed the coalition’s recent statement.

Whether or not the UK’s decision will help or harm the cause of LGBTI people in Africa remains to be seen. The early verbal reactions by some African governments do not bode well. What is evident for now, however, is that the UK government has so far neglected to engage with or to listen to the very people whom its policies purport to assist. The African activists’ statement is a tremendous opportunity to hear the voice of the grass, whispering its crystalline message on the wind, even as it is being stomped by those elephants on high.
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#425368 - 12/15/11 11:22 PM Re: Obama endorsing gay rights movement in Belize [Re: Marty]
Cooper Offline
Barrow told Amandala that he has not yet seen the memo himself, but he doesn’t care what it says, as the Government of Belize will not move from its stance.

Well just great that he does not need to be informed.
This thread is probably being observed...time for this country to take a deep look at the problems of their people. Starting first with education. On Caye Caulker only a few get to go to school past the 6th grade. And then its crime and drugs and theft. No wonder they wont deal with our gay friends........
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