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Posted By: Marty pedros gone - 03/29/09 04:44 AM
i'm thru with him i can't spend all the extra time. i don't care if he's right or wrong when he's on it makes this board a full time job.
Posted By: reaper Re: pedros gone - 03/29/09 05:03 AM
I guess we'll have to take down that statue of him in Central Park now...
Posted By: champion Re: pedros gone - 03/29/09 05:26 AM
My guess is, if there was a breathalizer in his computer, He would be ok!
Posted By: Nancy1340 Re: pedros gone - 03/29/09 05:44 AM
The only way he'll get anymore of our business (not that that's a big deal) is if we get a pizza to go. We certainly won't go back to his bar to drink.
Posted By: terrielinn Re: pedros gone - 03/29/09 05:45 AM
Alright, I want to know who the winner of the pool was. Who had 7 days? I know it wasn't me - I didn't expect him to break his record (atleast I think it is a record for him wink )

hehe grin
Posted By: Caye Connect Re: pedros gone - 03/29/09 02:19 PM
Like a steam locomotive, rollin' down the track
He's gone, gone, nothin's gonna bring him back...He's gone.
Posted By: Ernie B Re: pedros gone - 03/29/09 02:33 PM
Its about time.
Posted By: Otteralum Re: pedros gone - 03/29/09 02:39 PM
sorry Marty. You've done so much for the community -- real and virtual -- that it shouldn't be that hard.

Posted By: Welland Re: pedros gone - 03/29/09 03:41 PM
So be it!!!! He has no one to blame but himself. AMEN
Posted By: azbob Re: pedros gone - 03/29/09 03:50 PM
Marty your job is supposed to be fun! I understand and he just could not behave himself.
Posted By: Marty Re: pedros gone - 03/29/09 03:55 PM
its more like when he's on i get lots of email complaints and then responses from him and back and forth ad nauseum. he really often rubs folks the wrong way, i think he likes the reactions, but it gets old.
Posted By: spl Re: pedros gone - 03/29/09 04:22 PM
Originally Posted by Marty
i think he likes the reactions, but it gets old.


Exactly. We are not in highschool school anymore looking to intentionally upset people for reactions.
Posted By: elbert Re: pedros gone - 03/29/09 05:53 PM
grin
Posted By: 2MILESNORTHOFCUT Re: pedros gone - 03/29/09 07:20 PM
As many people here know, Pedro1 and I never really hit it off but that said, I never saw any reason to hate the guy, I guess I just do not like the way he posts things about people or sometimes business owners without all the true facts. That can be very damaging to one's personel or buisness reputation especially on a small Island.

I wish him well and will miss some of his postings as he can be a very funny guy at times. He has done a lot of good things for people and San Pedro in general but I also understand Marty's frustration when Pedro gets on a roll.

Maybe he will sneak back on the board posing as Deacon eek
Posted By: reaper Re: pedros gone - 03/30/09 03:20 AM
I think Danny2 is Deacon...tee hee...
Posted By: Danny2 Re: pedros gone - 03/30/09 02:31 PM

Reaper, you're not thinking right. I am who I am and that's all I am. I ain't no Deacon and I'm no preacher or judge mentalist.
Posted By: samray Re: pedros gone - 03/30/09 03:52 PM
about time.....you get what you give....farewell
Posted By: deadserious Re: pedros gone - 03/30/09 05:56 PM
In my opinion, there is a very nice ignore feature where anyone can choose to ignore anyone else. There should never be a reason to ban someone.
Posted By: azbob Re: pedros gone - 03/30/09 06:25 PM
dead, if I read Marty right, it was not just the posting, but the pm's and emails to Marty that did it! Way too much hassle!
Posted By: SnoopysMom Re: pedros gone - 03/30/09 06:40 PM
Or perhaps clarify the board rules a bit more.. maybe he didn't understand the "be nice" part. Just a thought.
Posted By: Welland Re: pedros gone - 03/30/09 06:53 PM
Originally Posted by azbob
dead, if I read Marty right, it was not just the posting, but the pm's and emails to Marty that did it! Way too much hassle!
What your saying is that Pedro was not banned because of his postings, but because of all the pm's and emails to Marty. Then Pedro shouldn't be banned but the ones bothering Marty should be banned.
Posted By: azbob Re: pedros gone - 03/30/09 06:55 PM
No, i'm just guessing! It's time to move own!
Posted By: pugwash Re: pedros gone - 03/30/09 07:05 PM
Originally Posted by deadserious
In my opinion, there is a very nice ignore feature where anyone can choose to ignore anyone else. There should never be a reason to ban someone.

If I choose to "ignore" someone, it does not stop their comments becoming part of a public forum

At what point does a business venture (yes folks, remember what this is ) with an attached message board that many of us are able to freely enjoy have to decide if the potential liability of allowing one person to "say anything" jeopardizes the venture itself?

The fact that one may successfully defend against litigation does not address the cost of defending against the litigation, does it?

I'm sure there are a few folks who have me set to "ignore", because primarily of the subjects discussed on US Chat, but no one who can say I have defamed a business rival or someone I personally dislike.

Some of us have thicker skins than others, and relish a good rumble: we exchange barbs and still communicate frequently via PMs, but there are others who are more fragile, and should not be subject to "bullying", especially in a public forum.

It is up to each of us to decide where the line is drawn, and for those who make wrong decisions, in the eyes of those ultimately running the board, a temporary or permanent ban is the remedy

I personally like Peter, and will miss a lot of his comments, but that's not really what the discussion is about, is it?
Posted By: travelqueen Re: pedros gone - 03/30/09 07:42 PM
Oh brother... P1, you are a total mess. frown
Posted By: deadserious Re: pedros gone - 03/30/09 08:09 PM
Originally Posted by pugwash
At what point does a business venture (yes folks, remember what this is ) with an attached message board that many of us are able to freely enjoy have to decide if the potential liability of allowing one person to "say anything" jeopardizes the venture itself?


Actually, message boards are legally viewed as hosting companies where the users posts are content that is hosted by the message board. Therefore, a hosting company, (aka marty in this circumstance) cannot be held liable for their user's posts so long as they respond to any DMCA takedown requests.

However, when a host starts to edit their content, such as in banning users and removing posts, then they start to open themselves up to liability as they are no longer considered hosts of content but editorialized publications.

If anything, Marty has exposed himself to litigation by banning users and removing posts if something manages to somehow get past his editing efforts.
Posted By: colomojo Re: pedros gone - 03/30/09 08:12 PM
Really? Litigation over a cyber board? OH MY! What is this world coming to? That's good info to know - I will never be a moderator of a board, that's for sure! Nobody would have any friends if anybody was mean.
Posted By: deadserious Re: pedros gone - 03/30/09 08:19 PM
The precedence was established by the DMCA with the DMCA Safe Harbor clause. Specifically the law applies to copyright violations on the web, but courts are also applying the definition to other liability cases (such as defamation) as well.
Posted By: colomojo Re: pedros gone - 03/30/09 08:23 PM
Interesting! I just would never have thought - but then again I can sometimes just be naive when it comes to things like that!
Posted By: pugwash Re: pedros gone - 03/30/09 08:32 PM
In order to qualify for safe harbor protection, a service provider who hosts content must:

* have no knowledge of, or financial benefit from, infringing activity on its network
* have a copyright policy and provide proper notification of that policy to its subscribers
* list an agent to deal with copyright complaints


Do we really want to get to a situation where we have to agree to terms and sign a waiver before logging on?

Posted By: deadserious Re: pedros gone - 03/30/09 08:38 PM
Originally Posted by pugwash
Do we really want to get to a situation where we have to agree to terms and sign a waiver before logging on?


You were the one that brought up liability. I was just pointing out that liability has nothing to do with it. If it did, he would approach it differently.
Posted By: J DOG Re: pedros gone - 03/30/09 09:58 PM
Well Done Marty!! Ya got my vote!
Posted By: Phil Re: pedros gone - 03/31/09 04:55 PM
I prefer the board with him, warts and all.
Posted By: 2Aggies Re: pedros gone - 03/31/09 07:52 PM
Hey Marty - We'll trade you Jhill & Danny2 for Pedro? You'll need to throw in a little boot to make it even.
LOL - I never used the "Ignore" on Peter.
Posted By: champion Re: pedros gone - 03/31/09 07:57 PM
You're too funny 2aggie! Wait, how much booty you talkin???
Posted By: pugwash Re: pedros gone - 03/31/09 08:51 PM
To get Pedro for Jhill and Danny, I think its us that should be paying smile
Posted By: champion Re: pedros gone - 03/31/09 08:58 PM
We have in the already!
Posted By: Hon Re: pedros gone - 04/01/09 01:24 AM
I think it's really unfortunate...both for Pedro (who is totally misunderstood) and for Marty (who, for a wonderful man, has to put up with too much shite)
Posted By: CatMo Re: pedros gone - 04/01/09 05:31 AM
Can I be Pedro now?
Posted By: champion Re: pedros gone - 04/02/09 04:19 PM
Originally Posted by CatMo
Can I be Pedro now?


Yes! Bang! You're banned!
Posted By: pugwash Re: pedros gone - 04/02/09 04:51 PM
This idea from last year is starting to sound better all the time smile

Originally Posted by pugwash
Yesterday I had the pleasure of seeing the San Pedro Independence Day Parade with Capt Jeff , TG and TB.

As we watched the floats representing many of the prominent local businesses come by us, one establishment was conspicuous by its absence?

I awaited eagerly the arrival of an Olympical sized pool on the back of a flatbed truck, with perhaps 3 or 4 chubby little silver haired statues peeing in it? A slightly overweight but still Gung Ho Marine in a "No Damn Ice or Water" T shirt ringing a bell and perhaps a few snarling ex pats wearing " Bad Peter" masks and frightening the kids in the crowd by shouting " you're banned", " you owe me money" , "you're banned" "Fvck You" as the float passed by......

Maybe next year?
Posted By: 2Aggies Re: pedros gone - 04/02/09 04:56 PM
I would give anything to be floating in that "Olympical" pool right now, if it passed the smell test of course. sick

On second thought, maybe I would rather just be sitting around with a cold Belikin and a few friends to laugh with. cool
Posted By: Marty Re: pedros gone - 04/02/09 06:15 PM
The posts on this board affect my reputation and the reputation of AmbergrisCaye.com. Much can go by unattended. But not everything.

Some of the emails and PMs that i get during pedros dustups are from him saying why he is correct. Its not all from others.

its a back and forth between several folks that occurs each time that i don't have time for.

the ignore feature is not known by 99% of the visitors to this forum and is not an effective way to screen foul postings. Ridiculous to even consider for that, as guests as well as anyone not familiar with the ignore feature would automatically see all the junk that should be deleted.

plus remember, anyone can go out in about 5 seconds and get a new email and sign up for a new user account on the board. That name would not be in someones ignore settings. With some abusers, its just round and round with new names all day long. Not Pedro. He didn't do that. But many others have over the years.

I've been doing this for 15 years. Many of the suggestions here i have tried like 12 years ago. Excuse me, but I have the experience to make this call. Its not JUST peter that gets deleted.

Originally Posted by deadserious
However, when a host starts to edit their content, such as in banning users and removing posts, then they start to open themselves up to liability as they are no longer considered hosts of content but editorialized publications.

If anything, Marty has exposed himself to litigation by banning users and removing posts if something manages to somehow get past his editing efforts.


hahaha to suggest when i pull strange posts that makes this board EDITORIAL is ludicrous. We do no more than basic maintenance that any message board has to do. No one is getting in and changing folks' posts. We pull one of a bazillion posts. 99.999999999999999% go right up and are never touched.

According to the theory above, any removal of any posts i guess makes the whole board my personal editorial?

nutso

homey ain't playin'
Posted By: Canam Re: pedros gone - 04/02/09 06:28 PM
Why are you even taking time to explain your actions that you took on your website that you created? I'm assuming that this was meant to be an informative site for casual observers, with the message board acting as a way for people to act direct questions about Belize to people who actually have been there or live(d) there? The gossip and rumor factory that these threads tend to resemble reflect poorly on the website IMO. Ban away and let others dig on each other in person over some drinks and in this particular case, pizza.
Posted By: deadserious Re: pedros gone - 04/02/09 06:44 PM
Originally Posted by Marty
Originally Posted by deadserious
However, when a host starts to edit their content, such as in banning users and removing posts, then they start to open themselves up to liability as they are no longer considered hosts of content but editorialized publications.

If anything, Marty has exposed himself to litigation by banning users and removing posts if something manages to somehow get past his editing efforts.


hahaha to suggest when i pull strange posts that makes this board EDITORIAL is ludicrous. We do no more than basic maintenance that any message board has to do. No one is getting in and changing folks' posts. We pull one of a bazillion posts. 99.999999999999999% go right up and are never touched.

According to the theory above, any removal of any posts i guess makes the whole board my personal editorial?

nutso


May be nutso, but that's the way the courts are interpreting the precidence set by the DMCA. If you pull content, you are editorializing the content and that makes you responsible for everything that you don't pull. Otherwise, you are a "dumb" isp and blind to all content your users post. The latter removes any responsibility or liability from you legally.

If you don't like it, write your congressman. The DMCA is a terrible law, but the safe harbor clause is the one good thing about it. Without it, no one could have a public forum without fear of a defamation suit.

I'm just suggesting you talk to a lawyer if liability really is really your concern as pug suggested. If it is, then you are going about this the wrong way legally and what you are doing will have the inverse effect. If you are doing it for other reasons and don't care about the added liability that editorializing your site brings, then I don't really care either way.
Posted By: seashell Re: pedros gone - 04/02/09 08:28 PM
I vote for Marty and stand by him.

Been watching what he's had to put up with since 1999. For the most part, I've been against any censorship, but things have really gotten out of hand in the past few years, and so I'm less inclined to be against censorship. The whole flavor of the board has changed, but I suppose it will change yet again as time passes. That's probably the nature of the board, changes to SP, changes in contributors, etc.
Posted By: azbob Re: pedros gone - 04/02/09 08:51 PM
Marty, you do a he** of a job! With out your on going efforts and the great people this Board attracts, I probably would have never found Ambergris Caye and my life would be so much less enjoyable. I'm in love with the island, the people and I'm "hooked" on the Board. It's an amazing place!

Thank You!

Bob
Posted By: Marty Re: pedros gone - 04/02/09 10:24 PM
I have suggested to Peter that he does a blog, then he can write whatever he wants. I would be glad to link to it. Then he can write to his hearts content but not under the AmbergrisCaye.com label.
Posted By: Barnacle Re: pedros gone - 04/02/09 11:04 PM
worked for me!
i can, and do, use any language i wish, post whatever photos i want, bitch, moan, and complain to my hearts content,,,!
AAAAHHHHHHHHH!
Posted By: 2Aggies Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 12:01 AM
This MB really prepared us for our first trip. I even met one of the posters before we ever came down. I was able to read about fun places, things to do, places to avoid and best of all where to find cool hangouts and good food.

Thanks Marty - for all the bitchin' there are a million good post here for those of us only lucky enough to visit. It helps make the most of our short time.
Posted By: Leah-Ann Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 01:30 AM
Originally Posted by deadserious
May be nutso, but that's the way the courts are interpreting the precidence set by the DMCA. If you pull content, you are editorializing the content and that makes you responsible for everything that you don't pull. Otherwise, you are a "dumb" isp and blind to all content your users post. The latter removes any responsibility or liability from you legally.
If you don't like it, write your congressman. The DMCA is a terrible law, but the safe harbor clause is the one good thing about it. Without it, no one could have a public forum without fear of a defamation suit.

That's an interesting take on the Digital Millennium Copyright Act you've got there, dead. I'm curious as to what "cases" you refer as support for it?

The DMCA does provide circumstances under which a messageboard provider could be held legally liable for content on its board - those circumstances are limited and involve copyright infringement or activity in some way related to circumventing encryption methods designed to prevent copyright infringement. There are only 100 court cases which even reference the DCMA, 97 of them brought in federal court, and not one of them applies the DMCA to circumstances involving allegations of libel or defamation.

Looks to me like Marty has the correct position on this one. If there is some way he could be found liable for statements made on a messageboard he controls (and I could only find opinions to the contrary in my cursory review of case law), it certainly isn't through the provisions of the DMCA. I'd be really interested to know what cases you think hold otherwise.
Posted By: Ernie B Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 01:39 AM
Damn it, I hate it when I agree with LA. DS has dropped off the deep end.... again
Posted By: SP Daily Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 01:39 AM
Hes blowin' smoke!
Posted By: klcman Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 02:06 AM
Hah! Everyone knew it was only a matter of time....... wink
Posted By: KC Jayhawk Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 02:18 AM
LA is just as much fun to agree with as she is to disagree with!! Although when I agree with her, she assumes I've been drinking . . crazy
Posted By: azbob Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 02:22 AM
But KC YOu have!
But so have I and she is "dead" right! IMO
Posted By: Ernie B Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 02:37 AM
I cant say much more, or Jese will nuke me
Posted By: klcman Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 02:39 AM
Jesse has Iranian contacts????
Posted By: Ernie B Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 02:42 AM
Ya cant bait me , Klc
Posted By: 2Aggies Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 03:52 AM
Wasn't this thread about...oh what was his name?........ummmm... the short opinionated fellow.....no wait that's me.....the other fellow.....with the pizza shop.....Oh Hell, never mind.... Guess I'll go make another crappy rum drink....
Posted By: deadserious Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 04:12 AM
Originally Posted by Leah-Ann
If there is some way he could be found liable for statements made on a messageboard he controls (and I could only find opinions to the contrary in my cursory review of case law), it certainly isn't through the provisions of the DMCA. I'd be really interested to know what cases you think hold otherwise.


As I said earlier in this thread, the DMCA applies to copyright. But it also defines a distinction between an ISP and an editorial publication. That distinction is being used, without reference to the DMCA in other cases, and in particular defamation cases.

I can't tell you court cases as I am not a lawyer. I can only relay what my council tells me. I'm in the internet business and in particular the content business so I try to keep up to speed on details such as these.

If you want the name of a good California based new media attorney who is up to speed on all of this, I can PM the info to you.
Posted By: Short Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 04:59 AM
Who cares about legalities. The board is moderated to decency. Try to type the name of the boasting party that tried to sue Marty (and us for that sake), you will get this: sapphire (that is with the right spelling).

Look at the bottom of the board right now: "The opinions and views expressed on this board are the subjective opinions of Ambergris Caye Message Board members and not of the Ambergris Caye Message Board its affiliates, or its employees. "

Let's close this subject and keep it reasonable as Marty states in his rules. It's his board and he can close it too when he feels like it, let's keep that in mind! This board serves the Ambergris Caye and Belize community, and we should be grateful for that - I am.

IMHO
Posted By: deadserious Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 05:36 AM
Originally Posted by Short
Who cares about legalities.


Apparently Marty according to Pug.

I just don't believe it's about liability. If it were, they would go about it differently and I simply described why.
Posted By: Marty Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 01:56 PM
maybe i just don't care about your definition of what is the law in this case. all the caselaw in this area is so new, i don't believe what you described would hold up.

whether you believe what i said for the reasons is as irrelevant as can be. i spoke the truth. contort it, twist it, deny it, but i still told the simple reasons why.

Posted By: NYgal Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 02:01 PM
Shucks - Just when I was going to tell Pedro1 how much I loved him and now I can't.... wait - he can still read! YIKES!!! laugh

All things happen for a reason smile
Posted By: Danny2 Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 02:05 PM

Lawyer's love to tell their clients " watch out for this and don't do that and call me first before you do anything". It's all about billing. Some of these lawyers have to bill 26 hrs. a day, and they do. I'm with Leah-Ann on this one. I'm sure she did the research and she is correct. Marty does a great job and need not worry about the small stuff that might happen and probably won't.
Posted By: pugwash Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 03:45 PM
Originally Posted by deadserious
Originally Posted by Short
Who cares about legalities.


Apparently Marty according to Pug.

I just don't believe it's about liability. If it were, they would go about it differently and I simply described why.


I didn't say "Marty was concerned about litigation"

I did say, in response to your "ignore vs ban" question, that one of the many issues to consider is litigation, but I also stated that it (this message board) is a business and that needs to always be remembered when evaluating content

Originally Posted by pugwash
At what point does a business venture (yes folks, remember what this is ) with an attached message board that many of us are able to freely enjoy have to decide if the potential liability of allowing one person to "say anything" jeopardizes the venture itself?

There are not too many restrictive rules here, but there is a line which many of us get close to and occasionally cross.

If anyone decides that they wish to live on the other side of the line, its their choice.

Unless of course its their birthday, when they get an a*shole for the day pass wink
Posted By: dogmatic prevaricator Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 03:47 PM
Happy Birthday, Pug. smile
Posted By: Diane Campbell Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 03:48 PM
This is Marty's website, and taking care of it is his workload. He has the right to make a judgment call.
Posted By: sweetjane Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 04:01 PM
hear, hear, diane.

this is nothing new. anyone remember soma???

sometimes inappropriate behavior or content must be squelched. marty is a level headed guy, and i for one trust his judgement on HIS BOARD.

IMO, lawyers have zero to do with this, it is PEOPLE who push for litigation because it is easier than diplomacy. i have never been solicited by a lawyer to sue someone. pursuit of that is on the client.

i have never held back my opinion on this board, but in 9 years have also never been deleted nor banned. ain't that hard to be civil, folks.

this board is marty's baby. we have seen it evolve again and again over the years. you all will be replaced by the next wave too.
Posted By: pugwash Re: pedros gone - 04/03/09 06:12 PM
Not for 2 weeks, Dog: Libertarians all over the country are apparently planning on getting together and throwing me a Tea Party, in honor of my English heritage smile
Posted By: Leah-Ann Re: pedros gone - 04/04/09 01:23 AM
He scores again!
Marty, you're up to date and it shows.
As always, thanks - and keep on truckin'! grin
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