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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 5,563
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I am a moderator for a couple of on-line groups. I understand the need for some ability to contain content that is attacking or foul language. However, it is important that I take responsibility for this.
It seems to me that people are asking for a few simple things.
1. Do not delete an entire thread - delete individual offensive posts.
2. Post a message of explanation - even if it is just a boiler plate.
3. Have a name attached of the person who did the censure.

If the concern is about affecting tourist visits I sincerely believe that reading about censorship will do more harm than allowing people to express their grave concerns about a very real problem.

How can we ever expect Belize to grow and develop unless the public speaks up? I am fond of saying "Paradise is not perfect but it is the next best thing." It is important to not act like it is perfect but to show that we are struggling to get better.

Harriette


Harriette
Take only pictures leave only bubbles
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 991
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I agree, scubaldy. I would elaborate, but I'm afraid I'd be censored, like Iluvbelize. I was replying to her post, but it was deleted before I could hit submit. Oh well, whatever!


Live so that when you arise in the A.M, Satan shudders & says..
'Oh sh t..she's awake!'
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 484
S
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S
Well put, but, I am afraid the vested interests have no desire to turn this site from a "tourist rag" (as defined by Amanda/Administrator) to a typical online public genuinely interactionable forum. I am not taking anything away from what Amanda stated. In fact, this disclosure puts right out front what many have been concerned with for years.

A
Anonymous
Anonymous
A
I agree with Amanda that much of what passes for conversation on this board is at least irrelevant dross for the casual visitor (to the site and to Belize). It's always been the case that if a potential visitor has a genuine question it's probably better asked on Belize Forums.

But that doesn't mean that there isn't a place for a site such as this one has become. It provides an excellent forum for discussion among expats living here and (in many cases) trying to scratch a living in what for many are very difficult circumstances. As one of those people I have no desire to introduce further gratuitous difficulties for anyone. But there are many issues of concern to people who live here that are perhaps irrelevant to casual visitors, and this board has developed into their main medium for that discussion. Like Scubaldy I am also a moderator on other sites (diving related, that being my specialism) and on those it is made impossible to censor without saying you've done it, together with some measure of public explanation and a fuller one privately to the "offending party". That's all I'm asking for here.

Anyway, I've had enough of discussing this topic. The administrators seem to have fixed on their position and this hot air won't change them. I do have one substantive question - were the dog warden's actions illegal? If so, who is going to take action against him? If not, how do we get the law changed?

Joined: Oct 1999
Posts: 84,398
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1. Do not delete an entire thread - delete individual offensive posts.
2. Post a message of explanation - even if it is just a boiler plate.
3. Have a name attached of the person who did the censure.

deleting individual posts can take an extremely long time. they have to be done one at a time. its not a fun thing to do. on a large thread, simply not practicable. if you think it is quick then you are simply wrong.

also, there is not enough time to write a report on every thread that is pulled.

folks that don't like how we manage this forum can simply go elsewhere. we are not going to let users set the rules. if you want to insult us, and say things like:

I am afraid the vested interests have no desire to turn this site from a "tourist rag" (as defined by Amanda/Administrator) to a typical online public genuinely interactionable forum.

then fine, you have the ability to state your opinion, and i will simply file away in my mind that you are an unreasonable person that insults all our hard work.

if this isn't an interactionable forum then i don't know what is. i am getting very angry at all this crap. its amazing to me that so many people can get so upset over a MESSAGE BOARD DELETION. man, either those folks cannot STAND not making all the rules in life, or they need a little more excitement in their lives. we are NOT going to solve all the problems of the world here, and i may get PO'd and just start deleting like crazy just to give these people something to really get upset over.


Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,603
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S&S, for the record, I wasn't censored. I pulled my post as I inadvertently posted when I intended it as a PM to a poster. No one to blame on this one.

Joined: Oct 1999
Posts: 84,398
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thanks iluvbelize. the conspiracy theorists are out. every deletion is an infringement on civil liberties.

i've been doing this for 12 years now and there is no way to please everyone, and ther is no simple answer. this subject comes round and round and one of these days i am going to simply delete all topics related to deleting as soon as they appear. we do the best we can. if you don't like it, tough.

you think this is the only way to solve the problems of san pedro? DO SOMETHING YOURSELF if you feel so strongly.

to quote a book i am reading, "On Call in Hell", by Richard Jadick about medical emergency work as a Marine in Iraq,

"Complaining is fine, but it gets old fast if you don't actually try to do something about whatever it is that's bothering you. If you're standing in shit, I always say, why not move your foot?"

you are not going to change things by harassing message board operators.

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 991
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Pedro2, it appears that the dog wardens actions are legal. I will do everything I can do from the USA to make this practice come to a stop. But, I think it will also take someone there to keep trying as well.


Live so that when you arise in the A.M, Satan shudders & says..
'Oh sh t..she's awake!'
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 991
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Marty, I am NOT blaming you, or anyone for pulling posts. I understand that it is a humongous effort on the administrators part, keeping this forum up and running and clean. I get it that it is a family viewed forum, and would never consider posting on it if it weren't. I'm very sorry if I gave the opinion otherwise.
I am so enraged by the dog issue that perhaps I let my anger leak out in other areas, and if I did, again I'm sorry.
I only have issues if the censorship is based on someones own political ties or beliefs. If an open mind is kept, and you still feel the post is innappropriate, then I'm all for pulling it. But, it has to be balanced. Agree?


Live so that when you arise in the A.M, Satan shudders & says..
'Oh sh t..she's awake!'
Joined: Oct 1999
Posts: 84,398
Offline
there is no automatic 'balance' anywhere on this. its not so simple as that. balanced politically? balanced morally? balanced how? take a vote? not practical.

we have to proceed as things float along. if it was simple it wouldn't be so hard.

wish it were simple. i think its rather obvious that we are balanced. we have admins from all political persuasions. we have admins that disagree vehemently. the admins have the same arguments as the public believe me. and when we decide its done. no going back. all the complaining in the world won't bring a thread back. when its deleted. its gone. can't be brought back.

i'm just saying until you have walked in these shoes, you can think you know how it goes, but.... so cut us a lil slack here. we are not trying to force opinions down folks' throats.

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