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#323969 - 02/16/09 09:49 AM Subs collide  
Joined: Nov 2006
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Danny2 Offline
Danny2  Offline

#323977 - 02/16/09 10:10 AM Re: Subs collide [Re: Danny2]  
Joined: Aug 2005
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Dan Carey Offline
Dan Carey  Offline
that's what happens when you go for a drive without a porthole to peek out of. Interesting that both boats are described as boomers, or missle boats. I would have expected one to be a hunter-killer shadowing the other. Boomers are relatively noisy boats, so they're a little easier to pick up on the sound gear. HKs are quieter, and whenever they hear a boomer going by they'll track it for training purposes. Obviously, the chances for a collision are higher when one sub is trailing the other.


"Facts are the enemy of Truth"
Don Quixote
#323988 - 02/16/09 11:30 AM Re: Subs collide [Re: Dan Carey]  
Joined: Nov 2006
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Danny2 Offline
Danny2  Offline

Dan, thanks for that perspective.

#324096 - 02/17/09 11:22 AM Re: Subs collide [Re: Danny2]  
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Danny2 Offline
Danny2  Offline

#324098 - 02/17/09 11:23 AM Re: Subs collide [Re: Danny2]  
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Danny2 Offline
Danny2  Offline

#324100 - 02/17/09 11:50 AM Re: Subs collide [Re: Danny2]  
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 1,925
papashine Offline
papashine  Offline
And the french tried to pass it off as running into a container that fell off a passing ship?? How did they think that this would enhance there position, lets see, one of the worlds most sophisticated weapons is out tooling around in the ocean, and is taken out of action by a "container" "wow" those merchant mariners are good!! Where were they during the cold war?

Reality..What a concept!
#324112 - 02/17/09 12:23 PM Re: Subs collide [Re: papashine]  
Joined: Apr 2000
Posts: 8,868
SP Daily Offline
SP Daily  Offline
These highly advanced "Attack Containers" are a recent development

#324122 - 02/17/09 01:23 PM Re: Subs collide [Re: SP Daily]  
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,367
jhill123 Offline
jhill123  Offline
It was my understanding that the 'Boomers' were the quiet ones. They need to be able to hide in order to make an on time delivery. If you're noisy, a much better chance of getting toasted before you can deliver.
And according to other articles I've read, most listening is passive, and with two quiet boats, there wouldn't be anything to listen to.

#324233 - 02/18/09 11:43 AM Re: Subs collide [Re: jhill123]  
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 503
Dan Carey Offline
Dan Carey  Offline
Originally Posted by jhill123
And according to other articles I've read, most listening is passive, and with two quiet boats, there wouldn't be anything to listen to.

all ships make noise as they operate, and reactors are relatively noisy. They can't be turned off like the electric motors of a conventional submarine, and their cooling motors need to run constantly. Now, they do everything possible to reduce their sonic signature underwater, but there's a limit to any technology.

Yes, submarines avoid using active sonar while on patrol. They use passive sonar. Attack boats, also called Hunter-Killer or HK subs, are used primarily as anti-ship weapons delivery platforms. They use surface-to-surface missles and torpedos to attack shipping, especially other submarines. Since their assigned prey includes submarines, including ballistic missle boats or boomers, it's my understanding that they need to be very quiet. The boomers are assumed to have the best sound gear available, so the HK boats that oppose them are stealthy.

From what little I know about submarine and anti-submarine warefare, any HK boat that stumbles upon another sub will follow it to study its operations and perform simulated attacks. The sonic signatures will be recorded for the navy's intel folks to study, and they'll often have signatures for known and suspected submarines on file.

The ocean is a big place, so the chances of two submarines from different navies attempting to occupy the same space are quite remote. Therefore, I would expect a much higher probability of collision between two boats that were shadowing eachother than just "passing in the night".

Now, I don't have any idea what missions these two subs were on-maybe their proximity was not randon chance. One never knows.


"Facts are the enemy of Truth"
Don Quixote
#324243 - 02/18/09 12:13 PM Re: Subs collide [Re: Dan Carey]  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,416
Barnacle Offline
Barnacle  Offline
I was assigned to a destroyer with anti-submarine weapons. We would play ‘war games’ with many other subs and ships. I was told we were eliminated many more times than we did the eliminating!
I was a boiler technician and on the lower level of the fireroom we had two steam turbine air compressors called “Prairie Maskers”. The idea was to blow a blanket of air bubbles along the hull and thru the shaft and prop to insulate us from the subs ‘pings’. Don’t know how well it worked for that purpose, but when we fired up the “Prairie Maskers”, all the ships stoners would converge on the lower level of the fireroom, torch up their doobies and blow the smoke into the compressors intakes thus sending all the evidence out to sea!

Last edited by Barnacle; 02/18/09 12:46 PM. Reason: add link

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