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Re: SAGA Financials [Re: Gaz Cooper] #380145
06/13/10 01:54 PM
06/13/10 01:54 PM
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 6,245
San Pedro AC Belize
Diane Campbell Offline
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Diane Campbell  Offline
If we have only one vet (regardless of where s/he works and who s/he is), there will be times when that vet sleeps, rests, gets sick or goes on vacation. When that happens we have NO vet. That is not good.
TWO vets, PLEASE.




Re: SAGA Financials [Re: Diane Campbell] #380147
06/13/10 01:57 PM
06/13/10 01:57 PM
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,206
Ambergris caye
S
SnoopysMom Offline
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SnoopysMom  Offline
S
Here Here! And the 2nd one could help Caye Caulker as well if they need. This is the ideal scenario for sure!

Re: SAGA Financials [Re: Gaz Cooper] #380149
06/13/10 02:04 PM
06/13/10 02:04 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,603
iluvbelize Offline
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iluvbelize  Offline
yes, 2 vets! Wouldn't that be grand? Heck yes it would be great! Mike DeShield was our vet - we had to fly him over from the main land and thankfully he was always willing to come to care for our then 12 year old girl who got liver disease - and with his treatment and skill she fully recovered to live to be 21 years old! Vets our hugely important to all of us - and I would love to see access to vets for everyone - cost wise and geographically.

As far as the income dropping at SAGA without vet employment that is an issue but with some regrouping and restructuring it could continue to stay open, fund raise to cover basic operating expenses and staff salaries, as a shelter facility and conduit for the community for spay/neuter coordination with vets, education outreach, and provide safe caring shelter for adoptees and other animals in need. I don't know if it could do anything like distribute prescription meds, but it could do flea treatments. The private vet could be referred to clients by SAGA for discounted or free meds and treatment if the SPAF and FOSP donations come in to cover that. May be easier said than done, but I am just suggesting an alternative plan in the instance the vet license is not granted, on this go round with the Vet Board. A gap will exist and we humans can surely cooperate and figure out how to cover that gap. The alternative is just close SAGA's doors? If that happens, perhaps another charity will be able to meet the community's vet needs in cooperation with vets on and off island. There are many possibilities and I don't think shutting down discussion is a good idea - anything could happen, a license granted, or not. Hopefully this will be a moot point and the license granted. But if not, then what?

Re: SAGA Financials [Re: iluvbelize] #380150
06/13/10 02:08 PM
06/13/10 02:08 PM
Joined: Oct 1999
Posts: 77,018
oregon, spr
Marty Online happy

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Marty  Online Happy
Iluvbelize, when you are relentlessly droaning on, shutting down discussion always sounds like a good idea.

Re: SAGA Financials [Re: Tim Callanan] #380151
06/13/10 02:14 PM
06/13/10 02:14 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,046
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Peter Jones Offline
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Peter Jones  Offline
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Originally Posted by Tim Callanan
At this point you can only be for or against , they are on their last leg

This is where we disagree, Tim. I don't think they are on their last legs. There has been an awful lot of hype and unsupported alarmism, but I think the truth is different. And the attitude "you're for them or you're against them" is certainly what has been promulgated but I don't think is warranted or helpful.

On a quick check (I am open to correction on this) I have been unable to discover any humane society anywhere in Belize that has its own commercially-capable vet when there is a private vet nearby. It seems that all or certainly most other humane societies have found a way of working with a commercial vet and surviving. How is SAGA so different?

But as I said I am actually pro-SAGA, just not pro-hysteria. Although I am not sure it's the best solution (and in fact I don't think it'll work long-term) I agree that SAGA should have its own vet if it believes it needs one, and I did sign the petition some time ago. So far as I'm concerned it's in the hands of the Vet Board now. I doubt if they'll approve a "full" vet (one that can do commercial work) but more likely they'll approve one licensed to do just charitable work.

Has anyone spotted that our commercial vet Laurie has gone on record as saying she would like SAGA to have its own vet? And that she denies ever asking the Vet Board not to approve a licence for one?

Re: SAGA Financials [Re: Peter Jones] #380152
06/13/10 02:17 PM
06/13/10 02:17 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,046
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Peter Jones Offline
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Peter Jones  Offline
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Marty - your extreme bias is very obvious. I had thought you were bright enough to see that there is a middle way between two extreme positions.

Re: SAGA Financials [Re: Peter Jones] #380153
06/13/10 02:24 PM
06/13/10 02:24 PM
Joined: Oct 1999
Posts: 77,018
oregon, spr
Marty Online happy

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Marty  Online Happy
i have been dealing with ms brannon (iluvbelize) for a long time. i'm sick of it. i am close to deleting her from the board and removing all her posts. now she is burning up facebook with her crap. it just gets old. she's beyond relentless. must be a taurus. guess what. i'm a taurus too.

yes i am biased, because I am bright enough to see that one side is correct.

Peter, you consider Saga's position as extreme because it wants to have a vet? Are you looking for a middle ground between evil and good? maybe you would be happy with medium evil? I am holding out for good.


Re: SAGA Financials [Re: Gaz Cooper] #380155
06/13/10 02:31 PM
06/13/10 02:31 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,046
P
Peter Jones Offline
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Peter Jones  Offline
P
Originally Posted by Gaz Cooper
Looking at the accounts, if I am reading them correctly and I am sure Peter will step in and correct me but I see SAGA's income decreasing by close to $130,000 odd thousand dollars should they not be issued a vets license and if that is the case they probably could not survive,

Drug Income $123,000 bze $83,000 clear
Vetinary income $46,000 bze

All lost if they don't get a license. that's a chunk of cash.
Gaz


I don't read the figures that way, Gaz. I don't know what the split of "drugs and medications" is between those that can only be administered by the vet and those that are sold over the counter, but I believe that most fall into the latter category. I accept that income for "veterinary services" would (mostly) stop, though I believe that some of those services are actually provided by persons other than the vet and would continue. But with no vet there would be no vet's remuneration, and I estimated that at around $60k of the total "personnel costs".

There are several vague areas as the information provided isn't detailed enough (not a criticism, just a statement). I estimated the net cost of employing the vet for 2009 was around $15k - the vet's remuneration less the income directly attributable to the vet. In other words, employing a vet was a small net cost to the enterprise, so dispensing with the vet actually saves money (viewed on this narrow base). But we are both working with very incomplete data, and I would like to be able to go behind those numbers.

Re: SAGA Financials [Re: Marty] #380156
06/13/10 02:37 PM
06/13/10 02:37 PM
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,603
iluvbelize Offline
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iluvbelize  Offline
Originally Posted by Marty
i have been dealing with ms brannon (iluvbelize) for a long time. i'm sick of it. i am close to deleting her from the board and removing all her posts. now she is burning up facebook with her crap. it just gets old. she's beyond relentless. must be a taurus. guess what. i'm a taurus too.

yes i am biased, because I am bright enough to see that one side is correct.

Peter, you consider Saga's position as extreme because it wants to have a vet? Are you looking for a middle ground between evil and good? maybe you would be happy with medium evil? I am holding out for good.



I am an Aquarian.

Re: SAGA Financials [Re: Peter Jones] #380157
06/13/10 02:41 PM
06/13/10 02:41 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,046
P
Peter Jones Offline
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Peter Jones  Offline
P
Marty - I am sure that your position supporting SAGA's claim that they must have their own vet to survive is honestly held, and I am equally sure that many other people are equally convinced of their positions. I don't know - the accounts that have just been published go nowhere close to that issue - only people working within SAGA can know that for certain as only they have access to the relevant information.

But even if they do get their own commercially-enabled vet, they are now in a new world. Like it or not there is now a well-equipped commercial vet clinic 100 yards away, and that changes the game. My quick analysis of the published accounts suggests that employing a vet has not been the cash cow SAGA would have us believe, though that conclusion is admittedly shaky as the necessary figures are not in the public arena. Whatever, the existence of the commercial vet is undoubtedly going to have a negative impact on SAGA's income, possibly a large one.

I guess only time will tell.

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