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Over 100 workers of South Beach protest

Posted By: Marty

Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/18/09 09:54 PM

It’s a project that has been under the microscope since late last year due to environmental concerns. The South Beach project on San Pedro Town is back in the news today and it is not getting rave reviews. This time it is because the over one hundred construction workers, in a preemptive strike, took to the streets of the island to protest what they term as eventual unemployment. But while the workers were acting on fear of losing their jobs, South Beach is saying there could be nothing further away from the truth. In fact, according to their attorney, the project is set to start as soon as certain conditions are met and the only problem they have at this time is a slight delay. Marion Ali visited San Pedro to find out what all the fuss was about.

Marion Ali, Reporting
The construction workers paraded from Reef Village, a sister company to the South Beach project towards the centre of Town. But they never made it because San Pedro police dispersed the crowd within minutes after the protest had begun.

According to Officer Commanding the San Pedro Police Station, Superintendent Dennis Arnold, the protestors did not have the required documents to conduct their protest. Arnold told us off-camera that in order to conduct a demonstration legally, one needs to get the permission of the police at least thirty-six hours in advance of the planned event. But even though the demonstration was brought to a halt, a couple of the protestors still felt their message got across.

Edwardo Vasquez, Protestor
“We are interested in more jobs because lot of people need the jobs. So that’s what we were looking into. The project is much bigger than this and we almost finish here at Reef Village. So the protest is exactly so that we can have a prepared job for a lot of workers.”

Marion Ali
“But why did you see the need to protest?”

Edwardo Vasquez
“The thing is some people here in San Pedro, especially San Pedranos are not with us. They are the people that don’t want the South Beach get approved. That’s why we were doing this protests so that they can see its necessary for our workers.”

Marion Ali
“What you mean they’re not with you?”

Edwardo Vasquez
“Well, they against this project, south Beach, they are saying they noh really want this project go on.”

Dillon Michael, Protestor
“Deh di complain bout dehn di—well I noh really know dah who dah di people dehn—dehn di complain bout di building ah di place and di areas, bout di mangroves. But deh got other areas weh deh could protect. Dis area dah wah nice area and ih wah benefit di tourists, ih wah benefit we di Belizean and other people families out there. So I noh si why dehn want stop di project from happen.”

One of those people is this man, who goes by the nickname “Moose”.

Moose
“The lagoons provide the life for our reef. Without our reef being alive, we lose tourism in this whole country. I can see problems with South Beach and their dredging when they do eventually, if they are allowed to, they will eventually dredge for that project. Silt from dredging anywhere on any barrier reef on this project can drift at least eight to ten miles on the average which means Hol Chan Marine Reserve, from which I understand is right on the border of the South Beach project plan, that will be destroyed. That will help bring the demise of our reef and if tourism dies in San Pedro, tourism dies in all of Belize.”

But that will not happen according to Legal Advisor for South Beach, Arthur Saldivar.

Arthur Saldivar, Attorney, South Beach Development Corp.
“After complying with all the legal requirements established under the laws of Belize, that South Beach Development Corporation was given on approval of its E.I.A. and the E.C.P., which is required before development commences. So the situation that occurred this morning was as a result of misinformation and mischief. I cannot at this point state exactly where it came from but I believe that given what we have in relation to the signed documentation from the government of Belize and from the Department of the Environment regarding our EIA, that our workers and those persons who seek employment opportunities in San Pedro need not fear. The parameters within which the developers must work is clearly laid out and at all times D.O.E. is in control.”

Marion Ali
“But is the project delayed?”

Arthur Saldivar
“Well whether a project is delayed or not, again…”

Marion Ali
“That is there concern, that after this project at Reef Village ends, until South Beach comes on stream they will have nothing. They will not have that steady income.”

Arthur Saldivar
“Well, at this time Reef Village is not completed as yet, there’s still work at Reef Village. It’s coming to an end yes, it’s almost built out but the approval is in place for South Beach so there should not be a long transition period from Reef Village to South Beach.”

Saldivar says the development will come in phases and will be a project that will put Belize’s tourism industry at the level it ought to be. Reporting for News Five, Marion Ali.

News Five tried to reach the Chief Environmental Officer, Martin Alegria, to get the Department of Environment’s position but our efforts were futile.
Posted By: Sarahvch

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/18/09 10:06 PM

Where can I find more information on dredging (how it is done) and the effects of dredging. I am honestly uninformed on the subject and only know what a few locals from resorts (north side) have told me when I asked about the sea grass. I would like to find more information that would help me understand both sides, how it is done and so on that relate specifically to AC.
Sorry if this is off topic.
Posted By: SP Daily

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/18/09 10:26 PM

Start with google
Posted By: Short

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/18/09 10:42 PM

I have seen this shameful display; drug users, illegals, and the usual beggars. Jeff Pierce has been going around town offering money to people who wanted to participate in his protest march. Wonder how long the people of San Pedro are willing to accept his BS. He is alienating from everybody on the Island.

Today at 5pm there will be a meeting from the AMBERGRIS CAYE CITIZENS FOR SUSTAINABLE DEVELOPMENT in the Lions Den.
Posted By: Barnacle

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/18/09 10:50 PM

i thought it suspect the first time i read it.
all though it is not below developers to slap t-shirts on anyone who will march in their favor for 10 bucks, why would they do it after the approval?
and if the hammer swingers are indeed acting on their own behalf, don't they know that the public has absolutely no say in what developers can and will do?

",,,,but our efforts were futile."

sorry,, i am just disgruntled,,,
Posted By: SimonB

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 01:09 AM

I was told by one of my employees that there was another interview where one of the protesters was asked why they were protesting and they said "because the boss man told us to" and something along the lines of "if we don't we'll be put out of work."
Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 02:12 AM

Originally Posted by Sarahvch
Where can I find more information on dredging (how it is done) and the effects of dredging. I am honestly uninformed on the subject and only know what a few locals from resorts (north side) have told me when I asked about the sea grass.


(sorry everyone, but she asked....)

http://www.mangroveactionproject.or...ortant-mangroves-marine-reserve-and-reef

//ambergriscaye.com/art/GreenReefOpenLetter.pdf

http://belizenews.com/pdfs/Pelican_Review.pdf
Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 02:16 AM

Originally Posted by Short
I have seen this shameful display; drug users, illegals, and the usual beggars. Jeff Pierce has been going around town offering money to people who wanted to participate in his protest march. Wonder how long the people of San Pedro are willing to accept his BS. He is alienating from everybody on the Island.[/b]


i just thought this needed to be said again.
Posted By: ScubaLdy

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 05:30 AM

Tonight’s meeting was great. Even more people this week. There will be another one again next Wednesday night – again at 5:00 at the Lions Den. They have two videos showing the abundance of life in that wetland where the developer contents there is no life. Some of Jeff Pierce’s past projects were discussed. You can do research on the internet.


Minister Manuel Heredia Jr. was there and vowed that he would see to it that Reef Village adhered to all the laws and regulations. It was reported that even though he has not been given final approval nor has he paid the bond that is required before any constructions is done he as moved materials into the area. Supposedly there will be a stop put to that tomorrow.

The committee posted the list of their officers who will serve one year terms. T-Shirts have been made and are selling for $20 BZ each as a means of raising funds and spreading the word.


This is a very dedicated and committed group of people. If you care about the future of this island I urge you to sign up to become a member. (I’ll try to get you and e-mail address tomorrow). The group is not just targeting Reef Village – they are dedicated to overseeing all development and protecting their homeland.
Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 03:11 PM

Note to self.......Never get Harriette really mad at me.

Now having said that, what does this group propose as an acceptable development of the area in question?

Why is this area so important when compared to other areas some of which are even larger such as the ones to the west of town.

The west side developments may also affect Hol Chan and certainly will increase traffic / congestion on the island.

When was the last time anyone from this group spent any amount of time actually on this area in question other than to document Jeff's activities?

When was the last time anyone from this group tried to visit the Marco Gonzalez site?

When was the last time anyone from this group tried to just walk across this area?

When was the last time anyone from this group even rode a cart further south than Joe's Gro?

What type of plant / wild life lived where the members of this group currently live?

I don't really know Jeff (only met him once) and I'm not sure exactly how I feel about SBB but these are just a few straight forward questions that deserve straight forward answers.

Posted By: ScubaLdy

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 03:35 PM

There are people way more qualified than me to answer your questions but I will give it a start.

1. Good idea not to get me mad at you. LOL
2. This area is so important as it is the mangrove nursery area for Hol Chan Marine Reserve.
3. This group is looking at all developments and committed to upholding the laws of Belize. Dredging on the west side of the island will not create silt that will drift onto the reef. However, digging out Mangroves is still against the law.
4. The people of this group are San Pedranas. Billy Leslie is a full time dive instructor/operator and president of the Tour Guide Association. Mito Paz is in charge of Green Reef. These and many other have made many trips to this area BY BOAT! There is no solid ground – it is wet land.
5. I don’t know when the last time any one went to Marco Gonzalez but it is on the only solid piece of ground in that area and these folks have lived here all their life and know the area well.
6. WALK ACROSS – I don’t think any of them can walk on water – YET! LOL This area is teaming with fish and birds but Jeff Pierce’s paid ecologist said there was not life here.
7. I only know where one of the group lives – it is by the high school. Maybe someone else can find the answers to this.

I’m glad you are asking the right questions. I hope you are open to hearing the right answers. As one of the co-vice chairman said at the meeting a week ago. As we grew up everything that wasn’t solid land we called “Swamp.’ We called the lagoon swamp, mangrove islands swamp, everything that you could not walk on we called swamp. We need to change that.


Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 04:02 PM

I am VERY open to correct answers.

Let me ask a couple of rebuttal questions now.

How could anyone know or guarantee that slit from dredgeing on the west side esp. in the currently proposed or under development sites to the south-west of town will not make it's way to the reef. Have you swam in Boca Chica before? Let me tell you, that current can be impressive at times.

Aren't some of the west side developments on "wet lands"?

Do mangrove and wild life live on the west side?

Wouldn't it be nice to have the option to walk to the Marco site?
Wouldn't that be another "sustainable" tourist attraction?
While working on my property I have had more than one set of tourists stop and ask directions to the site. I just point toward the brush and say "good luck, I couldn't get to it even with my GPS".

Who gets to decide what businesses / developments are "sustainable"?

There's an "ice cream shop" in town that I visited last week. I asked for strawberry but the worker informed me that they had only one flavor. That doesn't seem very sustainable to me but it's was and I guess still is open.

It just seems unjust to sell land to an individual but then tell that individual they can't build on their own land. If the town, central government, local people wanted this area to be a preserve then they should have purchased it and designated it as such.

Does this group prefer to see no further developments of any type?
Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 04:09 PM

Has the group proposed a "reasonable" alternative to the currently proposed SBB?

I quoted reasonable because once again you come to "who gets to decide what is reasonable?".
Posted By: Peter Jones

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 04:29 PM

Originally Posted by ScubaLdy
There are people way more qualified than me to answer your questions

Precisely. Why don't you contact Mito Paz at Green Reef or Billie Leslie at Tuff-e-Nuff for an authoritative explanation from someone who knows and understands what the issues are?

As to why people can't do whatever they want with property they own, the answer is simply that it isn't in the public's best interests and a political decision was made long ago that there would be restrictions placed. This general policy must have been well known to the purchasers of that property, as it's standard in any country that I've ever visited. The detail of those restrictions depends on local circumstances, as in any other country.

As to why the SBB area is particularly sensitive, ask the gentlemen above. But a simple glance at a map shows that it's right on top of Hol Chan and it is disingenuous to hold out that there won't be a significant effect.

Why don't you attend one of these meetings, listen to the arguments and watch whatever information they screen, and ask the acknowledged local experts your questions? They are not rabble-rousing special-interest group meetings, but are intended to inform the general public. Yesterday's was attended by our Minister for Tourism, no less, not pontificating from the high table but sitting in the audience and listening/watching with the rest of us.

Your final point. It is not up to this group or any other to develop or propose commercial ventures that any individual might consider. It is merely to prevent an initiative by any individual or business that seems inappropriate and against the public interest.
Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 04:36 PM

I'd love to go to the meetings but unfortunately I'm in Mississippi working.

I didn't say people can do whatever they want with their land. There are always limitations / requiremnets to build anywhere.

This land was sold to a developer with the intent to develop it.

It was never part any reserve that I know of. If I'm wrong on the reserve issue then please prove me incorrect.
Posted By: Peter Jones

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 04:41 PM

Sorry, I added a final clause after you posted.

Regardless of when, why or how the land was sold and whatever purpose was stated or not stated, public policy must take precedence. The land is not in the Hol Chan reserve, at least I don't think it is, but it does border it. In other countries such as the UK and US a protected reserve can and often does include privately owned land. That land can then be freely used by its owner so long as certain lines aren't crossed. Seems to me eminently sensible.

If you aren't here, why don't you write to Mito Paz and ask him for his views and his reasons for holding them? His is one of the most authoritative voices here.
Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 05:01 PM

Give me his email I'll do so.

One more question for you.

How close to Hol Chan is "too close for development"?

If protection of Hol Chan is the exclusive reason to be anti-SBB then one would also be anti-development of ANY type ANYWHERE on A.C., C.C., C. Chap., and any other reef boarding islands. The polution / chemicals from boats, motors and people is undisputedly harmful to the reef.

My main point from all this typing is "why this particular development?". Why was it ok to build any of the condos on the reef side? Why is ok to continue to bring barges into the reef side? Have you seen the silt that is kicked up every time a barge docks no less than 50 yards from the reef? Did you witness the sludge kicked up in Scuba Lady's front yard this Sat. AM when a sand barge got grounded and repeatly tried to motor itself free? Think that sludge went to the reef only a football field away?

Why were there no "green reef" or anti-SBB protestors there to cry foul on this barge and this development?

Harriett why weren't you out there yelling at this boat and protesting this development in your own yard?

Do you get my point?



Posted By: elbert

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 05:08 PM

Originally Posted by Short
I have seen this shameful display; drug users, illegals, and the usual beggars. Jeff Pierce has been going around town offering money to people who wanted to participate in his protest march. Wonder how long the people of San Pedro are willing to accept his BS. He is alienating from everybody on the Island.

Today at 5pm there will be a meeting from the AMBERGRIS CAYE CITIZENS FOR SUSTAINABLE DEVELOPMENT in the Lions Den.

Short sometimes we agree!
Posted By: Peter Jones

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 06:07 PM

You can find Green Reef's website by googling it.
Posted By: SP Daily

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 06:27 PM

Mito Paz, Green Reef
100 Coconut Drive, San Pedro Town, Ambergris Caye, Belize
Phone: (501) 226-2833 Fax: (501) 226-2766
[email protected]
Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 06:47 PM

Thank you Jesse.

Email sent.

Where were you Wed - Sun last week?

I tried to get around and meet all my boarder "friends" or "foes" which ever light you consider me to be.

Posted By: SP Daily

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 07:57 PM

Next time put some effort into meeting the people who can answer all your questions.
Posted By: t42

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 08:12 PM

Anyone know who his investors are?
Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 09:31 PM

I put some effort into meeting you but a lot of good that did me.

Seriously though, I did go to the town counsel and met with the building inspector on an issue of my own and we did also discuss SBB.

Oh, yea; have you bought one of Pedro1's tee-shirts yet?
I bought one for me. I'll buy one for you next time I'm down.

Posted By: GAY AND DAVID

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 10:09 PM

Sorry, i disagree with the effort part. if they don't want to answer your question, they won't. everyone has an agenda.
Posted By: SP Daily

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 10:14 PM

Chasing me for answers is a complete waste of time. I'm a stay-at-home old retired guy who only publishes whatever I find on the net. I never express opinions and never write articles. Go talk to the doers and leaders.
Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 10:35 PM

You never express an opinion????????????
Posted By: SP Daily

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 11:04 PM

Not on the issues...only on the jerques that post BS...
Posted By: elbert

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 11:21 PM

The San Pedro Sun Thu, 19 Feb 2009 08:06 AM PST
South Beach Belize has been a burning issue since it was introduced as a concept. South Beach has received criticism from various environmental groups, but has also seen the support of the over 200 construction workers of its sister investment, Reef Village.

The workers are multiplying.
Perice is recruiting more dregs of our island to wear t shirts and walk around complaining.
Posted By: Diane Campbell

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 11:45 PM

IMHO Southbeach is a bad idea at a worse time.
Posted By: cracked up

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 11:50 PM

even the name's bad, reflexion of the guy, no class
Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/19/09 11:52 PM

//ambergriscaye.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/324143/progress.html#Post324143
Posted By: RathaBnBelize

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 01:00 AM

Diane ..why do you say the timing is bad? ..just curious
Posted By: pamkillen

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 05:45 PM

You have to be clear that the project is for over 7000 rooms,plus casino and multiple outbuildings. It will utterly destroy the marine reserve,the reef, and hence the economy of the island.Of course there are protesters . They are being paid by the developer and have said so. This design has been drawn up by someone who is either crazy or does not care at all that this project will destroy the island. It never should have even been considered.




Posted By: ACCSD

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 05:45 PM

The Ambergris Caye Citizens for Sustainable Development's committee is as follows:

Co- Chairman - Elito Arceo/Miguel Alamilla
Co - vice Chair Catherine Paz/Kevin Gonzalez
Co - Secretary - Chris Beaumont, Kirah Foreman
Treasurer - Sarah Dalsin
PR coordinator - Rebecca Arceo
Directors - Mito Paz, Billy Leslie

The Ambergris Caye Citizens for Sustainable Development's mission is to support and promote sustainable development on Ambergris Caye and in its surrounding area through education, awareness and citizen involvement. Sustainable development meets the needs of the present while protecting and enhancing natural resources without compromising the livelihood of this and future generations.

We currently have over 300 members from all sections of the Ambergris Caye population. Our current goal is to build our membership so that we can continue to support the Ambergris Cayes planning committees decision not to approve the South Beach Development.

The South Beach Development are already breaking the Environmental Compliance plan that was signed on the 16th Feb 2009. It states"4.07 The Performance Bond shall be submitted to the DOE thirty (30) days prior to the commencement of any development activity". On Tuesday 17th Feb 2009 South Beach started dumping sand inside the development to construct roads and cutting mangroves to run survey lines. As of Wednesday 18th Feb 2009 this bond had not been paid by South Beach. The DOE have been informed of this breach and we are awaiting their response.

Please email [email protected] for further questions. We have another meeting on Wednesday 25th at the Lions Den. To view the video we produced, that was shown on San Pedro channel 7 showing dated footage of the bird and fish life within the South Beach area go to
www.youtube.com/watch?v=FBJFT4vwUZE

Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 06:16 PM

excerpt from the SBB email, received on 2/17/09:

"Construction has begun. "
Posted By: Moose In Belize

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 06:46 PM

Why do the message board administrators allow discussion about this development while frequently cutting off discussions about other developments? I read just as much mudslinging about this development and developer and yet the administrators choose to let it go on. All topics should be treated equally. I wish Marty would clarify.
Posted By: Pedro1

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 06:59 PM

I think it is because JP sells his own project and all others use realtors
Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 07:26 PM

perhaps some developments stand to hurt only unwary investors, where the hurt of some other developments runs significantly deeper, and in more ways than one.

just a hunch.
Posted By: Canam

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 07:35 PM

It's been a while since I've lived there, but it is very surprising that a developer can project to make any money right now on anything. I was under the impression that there are a lot of incomplete projects already, and have been for some time. I guess I'm just jealous that there apparently are still a lot of people out there who can afford beach-front property.
Posted By: Barnacle

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 07:46 PM

i agree with SJ.
most say the 'Sustainable Commities' are against ALL development. but they seem to be the only ones who bother to look beyond the immediate buck.
despite what people say, these people really truly care about the area and it's future!
Posted By: pamkillen

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 08:18 PM

People are adamantly opposed to this development because of the insane size of it. 7000 plus rooms. Stop and think about how many people that brings to a fragile ecosystem. Think for a minute about the impact of constructing that giant a project on Hol Chan which is directly across the water. Think for a minute of the affect on the fragile Maya site Marco Gonzalaz which the resort encompasses. And the fact that it appears to have gone around the usual permitting process. The project, by the sheer enormity of it threatens every aspect of island life. It is also self reliant so local merchants will suffer.
It is nuts that it has even gotten this far in the permitting precess
Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 08:36 PM

Originally Posted by Moose in Belize
Why do the message board administrators allow discussion about this development while frequently cutting off discussions about other developments? I read just as much mudslinging about this development and developer and yet the administrators choose to let it go on. All topics should be treated equally. I wish Marty would clarify.


I agree completely!!!!!!!!!
Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 08:45 PM

Originally Posted by sweetjane
perhaps some developments stand to hurt only unwary investors, where the hurt of some other developments runs significantly deeper, and in more ways than one.

just a hunch.



Come on SJ.

Check out www.brahmablue.com

Go to plans and check out the number of dwellings, 18 hole golf coarse and "yacht marina" proposed and currently partially built.

Any wet lands there? Any wild life there? Any mangroves? Any dredging needed to build?

Answer is YES to all the above!

Any anti-Brahma Blue protests / meetings going on?

Answer, NO

Question is why not?

Same increase in people, same damage to the eco system.

What's the deal?

Hell there's a huge development just south of Scuba lady not 100 yards from the reef. Were are the protestors to this development?
Posted By: Barnacle

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 09:13 PM

if you ask me, and i know no one did or will, but i believe the DOE or some other authority needs to decide when enough is enough. it's an island fercrissakes!
i have always said, it makes no difference if it's the greatest, most technically advanced project IN THE WORLD, if their waste systems produce pure drinking water, if their foundations create more mangroves, if the mere presence of the project brings glorious rays from heaven, too many people will ruin things.
tourist sites will be over ran, belize will loose everything it is known for. and that will effect more than what the small labour force protesting about.
Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 10:18 PM

what he said.
Posted By: pamkillen

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 10:41 PM

7000 rooms with 2 people in a room is almost double the existing population of Ambergris Caye. There is no way the the infrastructure on the island can tolerate something that size. The island, reef, and mangroves will be ruined. Check out the buildings that this developer has put up, without a permit in the lagoon behind Reef Village. It is a horror show of pollution, ripped up lagoon, and ugly buildings. Oh and imagine 7000 more golf carts.
Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 11:02 PM

Accepted.

Why do you not share the same feelings for Brahma Blue?????????

Does digging up mangrove and dregding in the name of a golf coarse and yacht docks make the destruction more acceptable to you?????????
Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 11:09 PM

he has a point....
Posted By: Barnacle

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 11:12 PM

it's all about the total # of people,, to me.
7000 people can have a good time at their resort or at the bars around town and if need be, build more bars. (i know, not the best solution)
but you can't build another Hol Chan or Altan Ha (just for example), and once these type places loose their appeal because of over-crowding, then what?
between the mega resorts the GOB is approving at every turn, cruise ships being aggressively marketed, along with all the other rush to 'develop', someone should step back and make an evaluation. i think.
maybe?
just my opinion,,,
Posted By: SP Daily

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 11:19 PM

Bring Disney in to run everything
Posted By: Barnacle

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 11:19 PM

belize is on that track, fast!
Posted By: Lan Sluder/Belize First

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 11:37 PM

The way I read the BTB statistics, in the last year or two, on the average day of the year there have been around 1400 visitors on the island. More in March, fewer in October.

This includes both "real" overnight tourists and folks who own houses, condos, etc. on the island and just come down for a couple of weeks or a few weeks a year.

In the entire country, from Corozal to PG, Belize City to Benque, on the average day there are only around 4,000 visitors in the country. (And fewer than 700 overnight tourists arrive on the average day, by air, land or sea.)

Where are all these South Beach people (and other new proposed or under construction projects) going to come from? Is tourism to Belize plus second home purchasing in Belize going to suddenly go ballistic and outperform all historical norms by a factor of 5 or 10 or 20?

Kinda hard to see it.
Posted By: SP Daily

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 11:40 PM

Disney knows how to bring 'em!
Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 11:47 PM

lan, thanks for always presenting facts.

i believe the stat for hotel occupancy averages about 40%. plenty of lodgings already available too.
Posted By: SP Daily

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/20/09 11:52 PM

You are overlooking the ever increasing group of "Snowbirds" who own or rent and spend the winter...4 to 6 months. Its a large group.
Posted By: collyk

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/21/09 12:00 AM

Originally Posted by Barnacle
it's the greatest, most technically advanced project IN THE WORLD, if their waste systems produce pure drinking water, if their foundations create more mangroves, if the mere presence of the project brings glorious rays from heaven,


You should do their PR.
Posted By: SP Daily

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/21/09 12:06 AM

Uhhh...you haven't met Barn have you?
Posted By: collyk

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/21/09 12:10 AM

jesse...there isn't an emoticon for sarcasm
Posted By: Lan Sluder/Belize First

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/21/09 12:10 AM

The snowbirds are included in the BTB statistics, as they arrive by air and are counted as international arrivees, but it is true their average stay is longer than the week or so of the average tourist. But despite the growth their numbers are still small, perhaps a few hundreds,in the overall picture.

--Lan Sluder
Posted By: Barnacle

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/21/09 12:12 AM

it don't matter if the people are sitting somewhere just waiting for the place to be built or not,,, the GOB gave them the green light!!!
the door is wide open,,,
kinda like,, we approved the construction of the nuclear waste disposal site,, but i doubt anyone would want to use it,,
Posted By: Barnacle

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/21/09 12:13 AM

OK,, maybe thats not a good comparison?
Posted By: pamkillen

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/21/09 12:51 AM

They do not have a green light. They can be stopped. When the giant project up north that had Korean owners was fully approved and people found out about, we took to the streets and it was stopped. South Beach must still be approved by the local planning board and if they hear loud and clear that the people of the island do not want this. They will vote against. But the voices opposed need to be clear and organized and numerous.
The Brahma project is horrible in my opinion and should not have permitted. When I first heard of it I thought hat no one was crazy enough to go forward. So I have learned my lesson and hope others have as well. When the same people started buying bird nesting cayes in the back, I realized that the greed moving here has no bounds and makes no sustainable sense. So we all need to step up to the plate and stop the developments that are totally destructive
Posted By: Barnacle

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/21/09 01:14 AM

sorry,, i thought it was all a done deal.
go get 'em!
Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/21/09 07:57 PM

According to the San Pedro building inspector Phase 1 of SBB has been approved.

That was from his mouth direct to my ears Friday AM 2-13-09.

He personally did not seem to be in favor of that project in further conversaton with him on that issue. He specifically mentioned the local authorities concern for the potential negative impact on some of the older hotels in town which have already seen a decline in use.
Posted By: Peter Jones

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/21/09 11:44 PM

After the recent meeting I asked Minister Heredia if there was any mechanism for ordering illegal buildings to be removed. He evaded the question, from which I deduce that there is not. The maximum fine that can be levied is very low and not remotely a deterrent to a builder, so on pure economic grounds it makes sense for a developer to barrel ahead with building even if a direct order to stop has been given. He knows that he won't be held criminally responsible, and the fine that may be imposed (no certainty that it will be) is so small he can write it off as a normal expense. And he has his building.

This practice isn't just in Belize. In Britain I have twice gone up against builders who ignored "Stop" orders, in one case building partly on land I owned, to no avail. A nominal fine of maybe GBP10k was imposed but the builder kept the new building, as he knew he would.

As the current building at SBB is illegal I'm waiting for Mr. Pierce to be ordered to remove what he's put up and make the land good. But I think I'll be waiting a long time.
Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/22/09 02:21 AM

What building at SBB?

I was just there last week there was nothing there and no activity on the land.
Posted By: Peter Jones

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/22/09 06:05 AM

Sorry, should have said building work.
Posted By: revealrealestate

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/22/09 11:26 PM

This video on South Beach Belize and its effect on Ambergris Caye just came through on my twitter stream -

http://toucan.bz/travel/south-beach-belize-how-it-will-effect-ambergris-caye/
Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/23/09 02:43 PM

"This video was produced by the Ambergris Caye Citizens for Sustainable Development and aired on local television to highlight the dangers associated with this and similar projects planned for Ambergris caye."

i watched it, maybe you should too (only 3:25). i very much like that they use voice-overs by local adults and children to present facts geared toward education of the AC residents regarding development. kudos, ACCSD. nice job.
Posted By: pnut

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/24/09 01:08 AM

I agree with jane, very well done.
Posted By: JZB

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/24/09 03:25 PM

According to my grapevine, the DOE has just issued another Stop Work Order.
Posted By: Barnacle

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/24/09 04:46 PM

i sure hope these stop orders come coupled with a HEFTY fine!
not something the developer will laughingly pull out of his shirt pocket.
Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/24/09 06:59 PM

Is a stop work order needed?

Last week there was no activity there at all.
Posted By: JZB

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/24/09 07:11 PM

I believe they had started building roads again.
Posted By: J9rancher

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/24/09 07:24 PM

You have to know Pierce if you are interested in stopping South Beach. By the way, he does read this or have it monitored. He is fascinated by Harriet I hear. His weakness is his character, not his plan.
I personally do not have much hope for any significant impediment from the authorities. There are too many conflicts of interest. Belize has some of the strongest Environmental laws in the world- sure. But it has compelling financial reasons to develop. The government needs a tax base, officials need a little extra, anyone involved at any level in the tourist industry, real estate, service, or construction industry wants development. The average Belizean fits that description.
Posted By: J9rancher

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/24/09 07:30 PM

There are 5 phases of South Beach. Based on Jeff's track record
in Reef Village that could be 30 years or more of construction if he has it approved phase by phase.
Posted By: Barnacle

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/24/09 07:44 PM

i believe your purty close on that assessment.
the GOB really, REALLY wants money.
they are willing to sell the country's soul, if someone offers to buy.
hi jeff! glad to see you read/monitor this.
send me one of those "I (heart) S.B.B." tee-shirts.

barnacle
general delivery
placencia.

EDIT: Xtra large,,, thankyouverymuch!
Posted By: pamkillen

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/24/09 07:53 PM

The government may want the money but more than that, they want the votes. There are many like minded people here, and the number is growing, who are well aware that the risk of allowing this huge project to go forward is that it will ruin the island and destroy its physical and economic environment. The stakes could not be greater. People from all parts of the San Pedro community are coming together to works to stop South Beach. There are members of this group from all walks of life ranging from environmentalists to developers to merchants to retired people to politicians.
Posted By: Barnacle

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/24/09 07:56 PM

and i wish you all the best of results.
if there is anything i can do, beyond my usual bitchin,, let me know!
Posted By: Inky

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/24/09 07:58 PM

The SB project will ravage the reef.

Ethics aside -
Destroy the Reef and you destroy major tourism $$$$$

The Internanal distain, and bad P.R. will also take a major toll on tourism $$$$$.

Earth Echo (Philippe Cousteau's Organization) champions reef protection.
I heard Philippe speak, he is passionate about this.

It wouldn't hurt to drop them an email.
(I would do so, but don't know enough to write intelligently about the subject):
Here's the contact page, if any one cares to try;

http://www.earthecho.org/about-overview.html
Posted By: SP Daily

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/24/09 08:04 PM

He was here not long ago.
Posted By: J9rancher

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/24/09 08:27 PM

Oh yes. I just watched the locally done anti South Beach blurb on youtube. It was well done, placed right next to a real estate ad in the menu somewhat ironically.
I hope you did not miss my point above about the timeline. 7000 units do not appear overnight. Infrastructure development like sewer, water, health facilities can come a long way in 30 years. There aren't 7000 units in phase one though you can be sure he has allready sold units in all phases. Pierce knows the island can't support South Beach without more infrastructure. He will have definitive answers for what he will make seem only fears. Every one of the "fears" voiced so well in that video will be countered by an expert with data. For example, many species of reef fish migrate hundreds of miles. A child stating that taking out mangroves there will hurt Hol Chan fish populations is and will be shown to be nonsense. We are playing with one of the big boys here. Faced with fears or answers who are you going to decide for if you are making the decision? Come on, Belize is flush with Mangroves (devil's advocate here). I think what at least the expat community is saying is they don't want the place to look like Cancun or 7 Mile Beach! That is what I think. Divers, Fisherman, nature lovers have a different vested interest which happens to be my interest. The mistake in this fight is using First World tactics (depending on environmental laws) in a place where they clearly aren't working.
Posted By: J9rancher

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/24/09 08:41 PM

The SB project will ravage the reef I agree. But not by digging those mangroves or putting some silt on the backside (Florida has dredging techniques exactly to prevent that). It will ravage it by putting 7000 units more of people on it, the tourism you quote. That is the paradox. Have any of you seen the coral in Hol Chan lately? That is why pure protection and building moratoriums is the only way to go if people want to see the Caye remain the way it is. Just like the Florida Keys. Trust me, I grew up there and nothing short will work.
Posted By: ScubaLdy

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 02:20 AM

INRASTRUCTURE! You think what?

Have you seen any delevelopment that has put in schools, parks, roads, sewage?

Unlike the US developers do not have to put in infrastructure first. That is left til last and may never happen!
This is NOT KANSAS Dorothy!

Posted By: Barnacle

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 03:34 AM

"The SB project will ravage the reef I agree."

and there goes the tourism dollar right there,,,
but at least some construction workers had a good run!
Posted By: J9rancher

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 04:44 AM

Actually Harriette, Jeff talked to me about putting in a hospital. We don't get along well enough for me to consider that anymore.
Posted By: J9rancher

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 05:01 AM

My point was that the water and the sewer will be built as the project progresses. What you say does happen, look at Reef Village. Portraying Jeff Pierce and other developers simply as greedy despoilers of the environment is great bar talk at Coco Locos but the net effect is you underestimate them.
Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 11:37 AM

hospital?? yeah, right...

no offense meant, but, who are you and what are you trying to say?? the only thing i think i underestimated is that $ talks even more than i thought.
Posted By: Barnacle

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 01:38 PM

i don't feel i underestimate them one bit,,,
Posted By: pamkillen

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 03:08 PM

There are 9 buildings that have been built at Reef Village without getting planning approval. There is no way to know if they have adequate infrastructure. I certainly would not eat any fish caught in that lagoon. I wonder if those same fish swim out front full of the same toxins. What happens if someone with the same building habits develop 7000 rooms some of which are not permitted and without adequate sanitation. Will we stop eating fish caught ear the island?
Concern abut this project is not bar talk. Most people that attend the sustainable development meetings are concerned citizens that do not want the island to be destroyed by this megaproject
Posted By: J9rancher

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 04:02 PM

No offense taken. I own a couple of condos in San Pedro. One is in Reef Village. Like most North Americans I like it the way I found it. I grew up in South Florida and watched as that was developed and the people came in. The Reef Village condo is for sale. I would like to be completely disassociated from Jeff Pierce. I do not like the way he does business. I personally produced Hospital plans at Jeff's request and have the wherewithal to have made it happen. I do believe he thinks he needs to contribute to infrastructure. It may be altruistic but is probably just business. Jeff is a lightning rod for criticism because he is visible, has big plans and because he has pulled off Reef Village. That makes him capable as well. Just because I don't like him doesn't mean I can't be fair. He has dug Mangroves sure but what development or homebuilder on the water hasn't? Precious few. The problem is that title extends to vegetation and property rights conflict with environmental ones.
Posted By: J9rancher

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 04:17 PM

So I am simultaneously (not just on this site) trolling for people are out there opposed to Pierce and at the same time doing a little education about what they are up against. Jeff is a big picture guy, he puts out the brush fires as they pop up (like a sewer system) but he must be a little worried or he would not have had his workers demonstrate.I do not think complaining about digging Mangroves is going to cut it though the local committee opposing South Beach is very,very encouraging. It is their country after all.Anybody given them money?
Another approach to defeat South Beach needs to be developed.
Posted By: pugwash

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 04:28 PM

Has this has become yet another thread in which emotions and realities are failing to correlate?

“Developers” should not be held responsible for schools, or hospitals or even sewer and water treatment plants. These are the responsibility of the municipality, in this case San Pedro Township, in which the development is located: the ongoing problem in Belize is that instead of collecting property tax to fund these items on an ongoing basis, a one time developers fee goes into the pocket of whichever crook is currently in a position to benefit from the “fee”.

Monthly dues paid at Reef Village cover not only insurance and communal area maintenance, but also the services that Reef provides that would normally be expected to be the responsibility of the town?

The proposed South Beach project is so far removed from other development that it is an ideal project to use to introduce a property tax levy, and offer ongoing revenues for sewer and water treatment services on this part of the island?

The density, location and design concept of South Beach are all legitimate items for discussion, but when someone tries to blame any developer for the lack of schools or hospitals, then don't the otherwise legitimate concerns become all lumped together under the “hysterical/irrational” banner?
Posted By: J9rancher

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 04:36 PM

I actually believe that Reef Village is on city sewer so I don't think pollution is going on.
I think Pugwash is correct. Property taxes are not collected but could be.
By the way Pug, if you are an owner at reef Village have you ever seen a copy of the insurance you are paying for?
Posted By: Canam

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 04:56 PM

You're right Pug - the blame is always levied on JP, but it's the people in charge that approve or don't actively strive to mitigate the situation that are to blame.
Posted By: Phil

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 05:18 PM

I live four blocks South of the Bridge and we don't have City sewer yet, so there's no way Reef Village does.
Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 06:21 PM

interesting.

pug, only j mentioned schools or hospitals. but waste treatment/disposal & roads for the increased load of tourists they expect, and miles away from town... and SP is supposed to foot that with the non-existant prop taxes?

someone please verify this: i thought someone told me that prop tax increase is difficult there because policy is made belize-wide, not different from district to district? (besides the thinking that if prop taxes dont stay low, people will buy somewhere else where they are)

so, who foots the bill for the roads, sewage processing & waste collection/disposal? san pedro? how?

and when the airstrip has to expand to accommodate all the folks bound for SB (or brahama)? and more taxis?

who benefits when they have their own restaurants, casino, onsite tour guides & watersports? san pedro?

these are some of my personal (and valueless) gripes.
Posted By: Canam

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 06:59 PM

SJ - this is exactly why these projects shouldn't even be entertained by lawmakers right now because no one has the answers/policies in place to your questions
Posted By: J9rancher

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 07:22 PM

There are property taxes. Collecting them is sporadic. There is also a 1% of gross business tax which the GOB has had difficulty collecting as well.
For Phil, look under the bridge the next time you go over. I think there is a PVC sewer line. Reef Village was supposed to have composters but I remember when Jeff was happy that he had struck a deal for sewer service instead.
Posted By: Amanda Syme

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 07:59 PM

The pvc pipe is potable water - not sewer.
Posted By: pugwash

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 08:37 PM

The point is that there should be property taxes: there is not a viable society anywhere that is able to provide social services and utilities without a property tax base.

Most regular readers are very aware that I am not exactly a huge proponent of Government programs, but there are some things that cannot be handled on an individual basis, even when the "individual" is a large developer

There is a very simple way to graduate taxes that would exempt most residents of DFC housing while expecting the owner of a $1million vacation home to contribute towards the cost of the police and clean water that they would like to be able to rely upon.

In the example just questioned, the sales tax and hotel tax from South Beach would be a net gain for San Pedro, as the sewer and security will be in house expenses.

Were San Perdo able to tax, keep and allocate the revenues, Belize's cash cow would be in much better shape than it is now with Belmopan appropriating the funds
Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 09:05 PM

and for the most part, pug, i agree. it is the last sentence that is the snag. i cannot imagine the GOB finding a reason to not keep the tax funds.

so, still wondering how the above mentioned stuff WILL be paid for. questions still not addressed.....
Posted By: Loansum-Al K

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 09:32 PM

So are there several septic systems on sight....and if so where are the drain fields......the place is surrounded by water.
Posted By: Leah-Ann

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 09:37 PM

Many things "should be." However, the lack of an appropriate tax base should not be deemed free license to maximize profit irrespective of the cost to the environment or the other island residents.
Recently I was present during a conversation where a Reef Village purchaser was asked about information that RV's sewer/septic system was built improperly and was leaking. Not only was there not a direct response to the inquiry, there didn't seem to be any concern at all on the part of the purchaser.
The prevalence of such improvident, myopic thinking will eventually destroy Ambergris Caye.
Posted By: pamkillen

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 10:34 PM

This is the first I heard of the hospital plan associated with Reef Village or South Beach. I don't know whether to laugh or cry it is so insane.
As to the sewer, there is no sewer on the north of the river and I still do not know where RV's sewer bed is.
Posted By: J9rancher

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 11:48 PM

News to me but I am not surprised. I'll just add it to my list.
Posted By: J9rancher

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/25/09 11:59 PM

Aren't you the nurse? No it was a fine plan. Aesthetics, plastic surgeons from the US supporting outpatient and limited inpatient services- the later is what I do. It has been done in Costa Rica. We even talked about connecting it to the casino for an additional revenue stream. Limitations in health care funding in Belize are certainly obvious but with say 8-10k in North American residents present at any time in South Beach it was doable and the local population would have benefited. However, I can't work with Pierce and I don't think the project should even be built now that I know more about the Caye.
Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/26/09 02:11 PM

what???

so, if i got this right, he was gonna build this thing, attached to the casino, so that rich US tourists could come down & get a quick nose n boob job while recuperating at the 'cass-ee-nah'?? utilizing US doctors & plastic surgeons?? (bz-in-us, you hearing that??)

and....an increase by '8-10K north americans at any time'? again, how is the infrastructure supporting those numbers???
Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/26/09 03:11 PM

I'm reading. Just been quiet. I've beat this dead horse enough.

As long as they do it for free in a government hospital or clinic then they can get their "volunteer" Belize medical license, otherwise; lot's of luck.

But if they get their "private practice" Belize medical license then I'll also be able to get mine so I say KEEP TRYING!

5 more years to go before we make a change of some type. We want that change to be moving to and being able to work in my own "private" clinic on AC.

Time will tell if we can pull it off or not.
Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/26/09 03:27 PM

Originally Posted by Belize-N-Us
But if they get their "private practice" Belize medical license then I'll also be able to get mine so I say KEEP TRYING!


perhaps, or perhaps not. sometimes things can be, um, acquired by some that cannot be by others. if you forget that, just re-read this entire thread.
Posted By: Amanda Syme

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/26/09 03:39 PM

Originally Posted by Belize-N-Us
I'm reading. Just been quiet. I've beat this dead horse enough.

As long as they do it for free in a government hospital or clinic then they can get their "volunteer" Belize medical license, otherwise; lot's of luck.

But if they get their "private practice" Belize medical license then I'll also be able to get mine so I say KEEP TRYING!

5 more years to go before we make a change of some type. We want that change to be moving to and being able to work in my own "private" clinic on AC.

Time will tell if we can pull it off or not.


You should be able to get your license to practice medicine in Belize - you will simply have to follow the guidelines and agree to the public service portion of your licensing which will mean working at a clinic/hospital of the Department's choice (not your choice.) So you might be stuck in PG for 6 months or another area that could greatly benefit from your expertise. While working in the hospital you would be expected to teach as well as care for patients.

Many have done this, but mostly Guatemalans, Mexicans and Cubans.
Posted By: J9rancher

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/26/09 03:54 PM

Sorry, I won't be trying. At least not for this project.
My point in bringing these things up is to demonstrate that Mr. Pierce does plan, does have answers for policy makers and is in general preparing for many of the big problems. The sentiment on this site is to dismiss him simply as a greedy developer.
Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/26/09 04:12 PM

I can do PG or where ever for 6 months.

Come on rancher, you're giving up too soon. I'm with you on this hospital on AC idea. It's rediculous that the most prosperous town in Belize has to transport patients to the mainland for emergency surgeries, C/S deliveries, ect.

There are quality medical providers on the island that just need the facilities capable of performing basic surgeries. The need is there, the patients are there and most of the needed doctors are there. The only thing missing is the facility and a general surgeon.
Posted By: J9rancher

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/27/09 02:49 AM

Thanks for the pep talk. Lets see how things develop.The devil is always in the financing details and as Pamkillen pointed out somewhat indirectly, there have been failures in the past.
Posted By: Peter Jones

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/27/09 03:34 AM

Originally Posted by J9rancher
Mr. Pierce does plan, does have answers for policy makers and is in general preparing for many of the big problems

Of course - that's how he's successful. Only a fool would "dismiss" him as anything.
Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/27/09 02:55 PM

answers? preparing? you mean like for every accusation, we can come up with a deal offer? (i can almost hear it...give me that permit, i'll pave a road. or, don't collect that bond, and i'll build you a clinic. no problem. i got it. um, but nothing in writing promising i actually go thru with anything tho...) a CYA expert?
Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/27/09 03:07 PM

More than just a "pep talk".

I'm quite serious about living and practicing in Belize on AC in 5 years. I'm also prepared to put my money (what little I may have) where my mouth (keyboard) is. My plans include offering surgical OB services on the island.

If you are serious about establishing a surgical facility on AC at some point in the not too distant future then please call me at my office to discuss this topic in more detail.

I have posted this in the public forum rather than PM in case there are other readers also interested in this idea.
Posted By: lovey and thurston

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/27/09 04:01 PM

Who will be responsible for maintaining such a facility?
Posted By: J9rancher

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/27/09 04:10 PM

Funding really is hard I am afraid. Services for Belizeans such as you describe would be wonderful but unless another cash stream can be developed you would pay a lot for the privilege of providing them on AC. The idea with South Beach was there would be a minimum of 5000 North Americans in residence at any given time and probably 4 times that in the winter. Medical Services would have to be provided, particularly since retirees might start to predominate. Some sort of facility would be required and that would of course be available to everyone. No support would have been required from the GOB or charity.
Hilton actually does this for retirement communities in Mexico.
Of course, there is growing opposition to South Beach for many good reasons so this avenue is probably out.
Talk to Dr. Gonzalez the next time you are there about average payments, supply problems, enormous duty on medical supplies etc. I don't mean to discourage you at all but it is very different from the US.
Posted By: J9rancher

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/27/09 04:13 PM

And anyone, feel free to steal my idea. Pierce would love to talk to you.
Posted By: Belize-N-Us

Re: Over 100 workers of South Beach protest - 02/27/09 05:15 PM

Been there many times. Talked to Dr. Danny extensively.

What I have in mind would be more of a surgical facility / short term stay / clinic rather than a traditional US type hospital.

Similar services on a much smaller scale.
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