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Personal Taser

Posted By: Loansum-Al K

Personal Taser - 09/25/07 02:40 AM

Hope this post doesn't bring up too much controversy, but is it legal to bring in a personal taser into Belize?
Posted By: BrusselSprout

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 03:02 AM

Yikes, I hope it's not legal.
Posted By: SimonB

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 04:07 AM

Don't taze me Bro!
Posted By: spl

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 04:31 AM

doubt it is
Posted By: tacogirl

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 04:35 AM

Shouldn't that read don't taze me spro lol
Posted By: TrueLover

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 02:48 PM

Not sure about a taser. Might just have to carry around a huge machette like everyone else. No controversy yet but give us time to work on this.
Posted By: elbert

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 02:58 PM

Why do you need one?
Posted By: JZB

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 03:49 PM

I could swear I saw one for sale at Ace Hardware in Belize City a couple weeks ago.
Posted By: seashell

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 04:10 PM

I'm with Elbert.
Posted By: Loansum-Al K

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 04:16 PM

Originally Posted by elbert
Why do you need one?

I didn't mean to imply that I needed one......last trip down I saw someone carrying one. Unless I was a female living all alone, I see no need to carry one. Just questioning the legality.
Posted By: Amanda Syme

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:13 PM

No, it isn't legal to bring one into Belize.
Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:23 PM

if one finds they require one:

my 10-year-old son made a taser by taking the casing off of a disposable camera last week. he learned how on the 'net. it uses the battery and flash mechanism for the charge.

Luckily, and with my strong disapproval and warnings, so far he has only zapped himself.
Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:25 PM

oh, before i get hammered with insults, understand that i have no control of what he does at his father's house.
Posted By: elbert

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:26 PM

Still laughing at that one Sweetjane.
Posted By: Amanda Syme

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:26 PM

Whoops, turns out they are legal - but there is some kind of licensing process that needs to be dealt with. I'll find out and post.
Posted By: Bobber

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:27 PM

Did he learn anything interesting? Basically just a capacitor and battery. When I was a kid, we just had forks and outlets for educational toys.
Posted By: Sir Isaac Newton

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:29 PM

I've seen them for sale on the island and in bc, I believe they are legal as with sprays, what can be illegal is how they are used.
Posted By: elbert

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:30 PM

I made a magnet making device by plugging into the wall socket a cord that had copper wire wrapped around a nail.
I put it in a cigar box for safe operation.
My father caught me after i blew most of the circuits.
Posted By: Loansum-Al K

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:34 PM

Originally Posted by Bobber
Did he learn anything interesting? Basically just a capacitor and battery. When I was a kid, we just had forks and outlets for educational toys.

When I was a little kid (a long time ago) I stuck a butter knife in one side of an outlet......burned two big chunks out of the butter knife.....I didn't feel a thing....I guess if I had two butter knifes and stuck one in each side it would have been a lot different.....probably wouldn't be writing this post!
Posted By: Bobber

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:35 PM

SIN, you can say the same about a machete. Of course, folks don't generally muck with you if you are carrying around a machete. smile
Posted By: sweetjane

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:35 PM

Bobber:

what he learned is - he needs to take the battery OUT before he tries to modify it! laugh

elbert - let's just say i check under his bed a lot wink
Posted By: Danny2

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:36 PM

When I was a kid my dad would wrap the hot lead to a large screw driver and shove it into the ground to drive earth worms up and out to go fishing.
Posted By: DGrefreshed

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:37 PM

I am a female who lives alone, most of the year, and I see no need to have a bloody taser. I can see myself now trying to wield one at three in the morning, no glasses on and stumbling around in my jammie jams half bloody asleep! With my luck all I would wind up doing is either tasering a gibnut or myself! Any weapon, even the ubiquitous machete, when presented will escalate a situation. That truism is law enforcement common sense. Do not produce a weapon unless u are gonna use it. Do not warn the mofos as to how bad-assed u are, u better be prepared to use it.

What difference does gender make anyway? With so many old drunk farts running around down here I would have to say that I am in much better shape to defend myself sans weapons than the average drunken old gringo could. No offence btw to drunken old gringos as I plan on being one about twenty years from now. (grin)
Posted By: elbert

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:37 PM

The magistrates have a new rule about carrying machetes.
Its not just a work tool anymore.
Posted By: Bobber

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:37 PM

The rite of passage on the farm was urinating on the electric fence. At least, that's what we were told beforehand. I still have an outstanding grudge against that guy. smile
Posted By: Amanda Syme

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:37 PM

Okay, there is a huge difference between a stun gun and a taser. A taser will typically cost you around $1,000 US. Taser won't sell you unit for export to Belize.

From what I can gather a taser is considered a firearm and as such you would have to go through the entire firearm application process in order to own one in Belize. Once you are granted a license you can buy one and import it and use it.

You can buy some stun guns (contact shocker)in Belize.

Posted By: elbert

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:38 PM

I thought that was an urban myth
Posted By: DGrefreshed

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:39 PM

Pissing against an electric fence I am sure will produce some sort of transference effect.
Posted By: elbert

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:40 PM

oops we aren't on the chat forum and I've just been chatting away
Posted By: Bobber

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:40 PM

nope Elbert. It happened more than once, but never more than once to the same person.
Posted By: DGrefreshed

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:42 PM

Ok look at it this way....transference of current over a liquid source....are we not taught that water will amplify the electrical current? I mean really, watch enuff cheesey murder shows right?

Now as to stunning or tasering? Bloody stupid fascistic nonsense!
Posted By: elbert

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:44 PM

Originally Posted by LOANSUM - AL K.
Hope this post doesn't bring up too much controversy, but is it legal to bring in a personal taser into Belize?

To answer the org. question .
Just get the attacker to [#%!] on an electric fence and if that doesn't work get a disposable camera and quickly go to the internet for instructions.
Posted By: elbert

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 05:48 PM

Guys I moved us to the chat forum hope thats OK
Posted By: DGrefreshed

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 06:07 PM

cool
Posted By: Loansum-Al K

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 06:11 PM

elbert, that's is cool.....how did you do that....are you a "Marty" deputy :-)
Posted By: elbert

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 06:13 PM

I did it. mirrors! I guess I am but should I feel defensive?
Posted By: Loansum-Al K

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 06:22 PM

Not at all!
Posted By: Bobber

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 06:24 PM

Water does not "amplify", it is just a very efficient conductor. Electric fences have a very small current. Hey, you just want to keep the cattle in, not cook them.
Posted By: KC Jayhawk

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 06:35 PM

Not in the field anyway!! Too tough to make a good gravy out there!!
Posted By: DGrefreshed

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 07:14 PM

Conductor....that's the word!!! Sometimes I figger that just because I have been sleeping with an electrician for 21 years I must be as smart as him? Hehehehhe....but as to cooking cattle I do prefer the barbie.

We don't need to get Jurassic Park on the critters yet.
Posted By: DitchDocDiver

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 07:43 PM

Actually, water doesn't conduct very well.. that is pure water, by the way.

We all know that the water we are in reference has a pretty high content of NaCl, and a bunch of other stuff. All of which makes it a pretty good conductor, hence, say away from an eletric fence, if you feel the need.
Posted By: Leah-Ann

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 09:47 PM

Wow, seems to be a lot of off-the-cuff , incorrect information being distributed here.

The first issue would be the transportation of a Taser to Belize. The TSA has identified the Taser as a prohibited weapon that cannot be brought past airport security checkpoints by unauthorized personnel. Individual states also have restrictions regarding the transportation of Tasers. For example California prohibits Tasers from being carried into public facilities such as schools and airports. However, it does appear Tasers can be packed in checked luggage.

The second issue would be whether Belize would permit a Taser to be brought into the country. It appears that possession of a Taser without a license is probably prohibited under Belize’s Firearm Act. Under the Act, “firearm” includes any weapon or other thing of any description from which any shot, bullet or other missile can be discharged and includes any component part of any such weapon (including silencers.) The Act specifically excepts toy guns or toy pistols and air guns or air pistols/pellets. Pursuant to the terms of the Act, any firearm or kind of ammunition not coming clearly within a stated exception shall be deemed to be included in the definition. Neither Tasers or stun guns are listed as exceptions and would most probably be counted as a firearm under Belize law. As an interesting side note, I believe a permit for possession costs $75 for a citizen and $500 for a non citizen.
Posted By: DGrefreshed

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 09:54 PM

Why this obsession with arming oneself for "protection"? Leave that baggage where it belongs - back in big-city USA and Canada. Tasers. STun guns - whatever. IN the hands of fools they are a deady weapon.
Posted By: Bobber

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 09:59 PM

Discussion, not obsession.
Posted By: Sir Isaac Newton

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:01 PM

probably = off the cuff

I have a air powered pellet gun that is potentially lethal (from Brodies wink ), Taser in non-lethal and is not usually considered a firearm (no fired bullets or missiles, spring/gas action as with some pellet/bb guns).

Not that it makes it legal, most folks at Customs may not be knowlegdeable of the difference between a stun gun and a taser.

A firearm as well as a taser can be checked in your luggage and brought to Belize, in the case of a firearm, released from Customs upon presentation of proper documents.

It is sad to see so many licensed weapons on the island. Sad that there sometimes is a need for such besides target practice and some hunting.

[Linked Image]

SIN

Posted By: Sir Isaac Newton

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:08 PM

A Belikin bottle is also a good choice for self protection and totally legal, even in luggage or in California.
Posted By: DGrefreshed

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:09 PM

I must admit a fondness for pellet guns only because I do know that shooting a would be teef in the arse with one would create an awful sting.

People have died from the use of tasers/stun guns. I wished I had the numbers right in front of me but I saw the reports on NBC and CNN there was no deviation in the stats which had been kept since 2002.

Bobber you say discussion and yes this is what we are doing here but in terms of what I see as a pervasive behaviour on the part of some folks who come down here? Obsession. Obsession with SAFETY and SECURITY and blah blah blah blah blah. Fears that to me anyway are so ridiculous that I cannot articulate my disdain in a proper fashion.
Posted By: Leah-Ann

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:10 PM

oh yeah, and as for the peeing on a fence stuff:

http://www.snopes.com/photos/medical/electricfence.asp

and let me just apologize in advance about the picture.... shocked
Posted By: Leah-Ann

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:16 PM

SIN, your air powered pellet gun is specifically excluded under Belize's firearm act. Tasers and stun guns are not. Your statement about firearms being released upon showing of proper permits/licenses is consistent with what I said. Whether a non-citizen gets one of those prior to arrival is questionable. Couldn't speak to how knowledgable customs agents are, but agree that is an issue distinct from legality, which was the original question posed.

I can think of so many better uses for a Belikin bottle... wink
Posted By: DGrefreshed

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:24 PM

I wonder how many of these weapons have already been smuggled in. Customs personnel, bless their hearts, cannot be expected to keep up with every crazy gringo gadget out there.

Was there not a report recently about a taser or stun gun attack Belize City? (I really gotta start a file folder one of these days)
Posted By: Loansum-Al K

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:24 PM

Originally Posted by TrueLover
"No controversy yet but give us time to work on this"

TrueLover, you were right!
Posted By: DGrefreshed

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:27 PM

Leah Ann.....that poor man in the photo and his aahhhhhh, shortcomings?
Posted By: Leah-Ann

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:28 PM

sad, huh? frown
Posted By: Bobber

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:28 PM

OK, Leah-Ann, but I beg to differ. The typical little electric fence boxes that we used on the farm did not pack that kind of punch. We would routinely bump into them while working with just a nip like a static shock. They did pulse about every 3 seconds. If a cow touched them (we bent beer cans around the wire to interest the cows) with their nose, they would just get a mild shock for a short duration. That snopes thing looks more like something they would have around a high security area.
Posted By: Leah-Ann

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:30 PM

Bobber - ya gotta read the article, not just look at the pictures! :p that didn't result from an electric fence...

didn't mythbusters do a deal on that and find out you could get a small shock?
Posted By: DGrefreshed

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:30 PM

EVer grabbed an electric fence (the "harmless" farm variety)? Very strange sensation. Now I wonder what 50,000 volts being forced on you would feel like?

Oh no bro......aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!
Posted By: Leah-Ann

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:32 PM

[Linked Image]
Posted By: Sir Isaac Newton

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:35 PM

When I was about eight and visiting the farm I was warned not to touch the fence. So I marched over and grabbed it. It rattled me, enough to teach me to listen to folks who live on the farm.
Posted By: Sir Isaac Newton

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:37 PM

A taser is not a firearm.
Posted By: Bobber

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:37 PM

Sorry Leah-Ann. I thought you were indicating that the peeing on the fence was an urban legend. It is not, believe me. Anyhow, sorry bout that, I owe you another beer.
Posted By: Bobber

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:39 PM

Mythbusters may have done something, but I could picture them with the fence, and some liquid source, but I highly doubt that they took into account the specific Johnson Rod effect. smile
Posted By: Leah-Ann

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:40 PM

Bobber, I'd never dispute you on that one! wink

SIN, can you give me any legal authority for your proposition that a taser is not considered a firearm under Belizian law? Just curious... the law is all over the place on that issue in the U.S.
Posted By: Sir Isaac Newton

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:42 PM

SPPD weapon of choice.





[Linked Image]

Posted By: Sir Isaac Newton

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:42 PM

The slingshot is not a pellet gun either.
Posted By: Bobber

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:43 PM

What is the definition, legally, of a firearm? A taser typically projects darts with a trailing wire. The projected darts are probably air or spring powered. Just my thoughts.
Posted By: Sir Isaac Newton

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:48 PM

A weapon, especially a pistol or rifle, capable of firing a projectile and using an explosive charge as a propellant.
Posted By: Sir Isaac Newton

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:51 PM

My legal authority (partner in the back office) says spearguns are legal and they shoot things and are not mentioned in the firearm law cause' no fire is involved. BB guns are mentioned cause they look an awful like real guns and shoot like real guns. Precedent.
Posted By: Rykat

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:52 PM

Just what I needed....that picture to complete my day! laugh sick
Posted By: Bobber

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:56 PM

Rykat, no worse than your mama video. smile
Posted By: Sir Isaac Newton

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:58 PM

[Linked Image]
Posted By: Leah-Ann

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 10:59 PM

No offense to your (partner in the back office) but that's sort of dubious legal authority! :p what precedent??

In 1974, a NASA scientist named Jack Cover invented the first stun gun, which he named the TASER, or “Thomas A. Swift Electric Rifle,” after Tom Swift, a fictional young inventor who was the hero of a series of early 20th century adventure novels. Because it relied on gunpowder, the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms classified Tasers as registered firearms. That changed in the early ’90s when co-founder Rick Smith became interested in the device. In 1993, with money from Smith’s brother Tom, they created Air Taser Inc., which would later become Taser International Inc. When Tasers were re-engineered to work with a nitrogen propellant rather than gunpowder, the weapon was no longer categorized as a firearm.
The Taser premiered in 2000—a model eventually redesigned as the M-26. By the following year, 750 law enforcement agencies had either tested or deployed the weapon. Today, more than 9,500 law enforcement, correctional and military agencies in 43 countries use Taser weaponry. In the past eight years, more than 184,000 Tasers have been sold to law enforcement agencies, with another 115,000 to citizens in the 43 states where it is legal to possess a stun gun. Taser’s stun guns are designed to shoot a maximum of 50,000 volts into a person’s body through two compressed nitrogen-fueled probes, thereby disrupting the target’s electromuscular system. The probes are connected to the Taser gun by insulated wires, and can deliver repeat shocks in quick succession. The probes can pierce clothing and skin from a distance or be directly applied to a person’s body—a process known as “dry stunning”—for an ostensibly less-incapacitating, cattle-prod effect.
Posted By: Sir Isaac Newton

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 11:06 PM

You asked for MY legal authority? His sister runs the Border Management Agency at the Santa Elena border.

"the weapon was no longer categorized as a firearm."

Posted By: Sir Isaac Newton

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 11:08 PM

That's not a gun...........











This is a gun.........



[Linked Image]
Posted By: Rykat

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 11:12 PM

Thats true, Bobber but the clown picture with his mouth open holding a gun is a pretty close third! sick
Posted By: Leah-Ann

Re: Personal Taser - 09/25/07 11:48 PM

Yep SIN - that's a gun.
Seems you and I define legal authority differently. What I was looking for was citation to some portion of Belize law that specifically either includes or excludes Tasers from categorization as firearms. I can't locate any.

In the U.S., the Govt. Accountability Ofc. notes the discrepancy in defination present at state and federal level:
"In reviewing various laws, including statutes, regulations, and ordinances, we found that Tasers were addressed in some federal, state, and local jurisdictions. We also found that these jurisdictions had different requirements for regulating Tasers. In some instances, the extent to which Tasers are regulated in these jurisdictions may depend on whether the Taser is classified as a firearm."

Posted By: iluvbelize

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 12:05 AM

Um, Leah-Ann, I believe the issue of the legality of possession of taser tech instruments in Belize would be based upon Belize law or policy, and we all know that such is not always reduced to writing in Belize.
Posted By: Leah-Ann

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 12:08 AM

You make my point exactly, iluvbelize. The law is not settled in US, I'm looking to see if it is in Belize, which is why I wondered if there was any legal authority which could be cited to address the issue!
Posted By: iluvbelize

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 12:09 AM

Belize It! smile
Posted By: Sir Isaac Newton

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 12:09 AM

I guess she would know more than anyone. I would think since it is not a firearm may be the reason it is not in the firearm law, similar to the omittance of spear and nail guns?

Posted By: Leah-Ann

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 12:10 AM

umm, well, you did make my point - before you changed your post! laugh
Posted By: Leah-Ann

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 12:11 AM

who would know SIN? I'm saying I don't know - which is why I'm asking if you do???
Since in the US some jurisdictions consider it a firearm and some don't, I'm wondering where Belize weighs in. So far, no one seems to know.
Posted By: iluvbelize

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 12:18 AM

Well, I'm not one to go making your point now, that's for certain.

Fact is, "firearms" is narrowly defined in US law and policy, and there is a wide scope of guns that are not defined as "firearms", and the ownership and use of same is prevalent, in the US.
Posted By: Sir Isaac Newton

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 12:18 AM

I was referring to my earlier post and my partner's sister at Border Management.
Posted By: Leah-Ann

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 12:20 AM

SIN, are you saying your partner's sister's emplyment is binding legal authority?

iluvbelize, I know! laugh
Posted By: Sir Isaac Newton

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 12:21 AM

It's legal (just like shrooms) here until made illegal through law or treaty.
Posted By: Leah-Ann

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 12:24 AM

well, i for one would never question your knowledge about drug laws! jury's still out for me on the weapon question though!
Posted By: Sir Isaac Newton

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 12:24 AM

I guess if she can legally allow these items into Belize. I don't think she is a lawyer or commissioner of the court though. In my experience I would trust a border official over a lawyer here. JMHO



Posted By: Leah-Ann

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 12:25 AM

that would make sense - do you know if you have to have a permit before bringing them in?
Posted By: Sir Isaac Newton

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 12:29 AM

But, to save bandwidth, you can be right, if it makes you feel better. FYI - making smilies while making a personal dig is very "white american" of you.

SIN
Posted By: Leah-Ann

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 12:35 AM

If I thought I was right, I wouldn't have needed to ask in the first place. (smilie removed in attempt to make you feel better)
P.S. - I am a "white american" whatever that means - as I recall, so are you. ??
Posted By: DGrefreshed

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 12:41 AM

Yeah no nail guns.....WTF is that all about anyway? Can anyone be certified/authorized to use a nail gun in Belize?
Posted By: Loansum-Al K

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 01:57 AM

Good point....are you allowed to bring a nail gun into Belize....I'm sure you are if you are willing to pay the duty.
Posted By: KC Jayhawk

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 05:18 AM

So, if I have assimilated all this correctly,under the terms of the Treaty of Guadalupe, the Geneva Covention and Belizean law, I am allowed to [#%!] on an an electrifed nail gun, so long as I don't bring a personal taser without payin the duty to San Pedro in the off-season for gibnuts!! Please, someone tell me if I missed something!! whistle
Posted By: belizeonthebeach

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 05:37 AM

That pretty much covers it, Senor Hawk
Posted By: TrueLover

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 05:39 AM

Would have been cool if it took his picture at the same time SJ.
Posted By: TrueLover

Re: Personal Taser - 09/26/07 05:51 AM

Factoid.

I am 100 times more likely to use a gun if I have one than if I don't have one. No!! a million times? a thousand times ..... <sigh> math, ....... :l Doh!!!!!!

BANG!!!!
Posted By: TacoBoy

Re: Personal Taser - 09/27/07 05:14 PM

I took a friend and his family to my parents farm a couple years ago. Dad still has horses and so he just uses the electric fences left over from when we had cattle.

My friend was reaching out to 'pet' one of the curious horses on the nose - his arm was safely up high away from the fence, but unfortunately for the horse, his beer belly wasn't... just when he touched the horses nose his belly came into contact with the fence and the poor horse got the majority of the shock.

As to the "Rod Effect" - I can't say from personal experience, but my cousin would probably tell you that it's not the most pleasant experience he's ever had when we talked him into peeing on the fence.
Posted By: Bobber

Re: Personal Taser - 09/27/07 06:33 PM

That would have to be your "younger" cousin, right? He became a man at that moment. smile
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