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Perhaps I have misunderstood you, Rigrat.

"Under joint and several liability, a claimant may pursue an obligation against any one party as if they were jointly liable and it becomes the responsibility of the defendants to sort out their respective proportions of liability and payment. This means that if the claimant pursues one defendant and receives payment, that defendant must then pursue the other obligors for a contribution to their share of the liability.

Joint and several liability is most relevant in tort claims, whereby a plaintiff may recover all the damages from any of the defendants regardless of their individual share of the liability. The rule is often applied in negligence cases, though it is sometimes invoked in other areas of law."

IMNSHO, every major company involved in a joint venture, should be prepared to take the full burden. Any one company can find itself being sued for the full amount.

Here at home, it often occurs that small oil company with small working interest, as partner with larger oil company, may not fully insure itself. Large oil company prepare themselves to be the party ultimately held responsible for the burden. However, should small oil company be partnered with smaller oil company(s), and also be operator, the small oil company as operator, should ensure that it is insured for the full burden, in the event of mishap.

Interesting how you insisted on knowing everything about me, and were willing to shout it from the rooftops, and yet this other oil professional is totally nameless and invisible

There was only one thing correct in your post. Oil makes money. It is how the money is distributed that needs to be focused upon.
The rest of your post was without any merit.
I actually have an incredible amount of data that will prove you to be totally incorrect. Please reply posting your data that.

"If drilling were to take place offshore Belize it would only be a matter of time before a spill takes place and this would be with the bigger operators like the BP's, a smaller cheaper route will obviously bring more spills and pollution.. and sooner than may be the case."

Or was this just an opinion?

No, I don't think you misunderstood me. Joint and several liability is how it is. However I cannot agree that each and every company involved should be insured for the full amount of the clean up. This would immediately stop any small independents from entering into the oil business and it would be left to a few giant oil companies to dictate to the world what would happen.
As only the operator signs the PSA, then only the operator can be forced to take out full insurance for the cost of clean up operations. If the government suspects there will be uninsured partners, then they can take immediate steps to cancel a PSA or will not sign it in the first place. Likewise an operator will not come to the negotiating table if his partners are not, or they are under, insured.
Under the terms of most PSA's oil companies have to pay into a fund to meet the costs pollution incidents. This is true of Belizean PSA's as well. Governments take a portion of this money to re-insure against catastrophe.
I personally do not know of a single incident worldwide ever of there not being enough money to clear up an oil spill.

Never actually heard this term before. I thought a fishhook curved around and almost came back on itself. Are you talking about directional wells?

Well I have to say that I don't believe this is actually necessarily the case. A directional well requires a rig with far more horsepower, and these are not as common as conventional land drilling rigs. plus the most expensive items you have when drilling a well are the casing and the mud. Because both of these are greatly increased when you drill at high angles due to the increase in measured depth. Then to increase your costs you have the directional drilling tools, and there is also the increased risk of wellbore instability when you deviate from the vertical.
So, in many cases it is far cheaper to get a swamp barge rig and drill straight down than it is to drill directionally.
Then we come to your point that most small spills come from the rigs and their plumbing. This is not the case either. The vast majority of oil spills come from transportation of oil.

As I recall these directional wells were first developed to drill from a lease site to obtain oil from a nearby site that they did not have lease on. Oil company ethics.

Not necessarily, but to drill from a surface location more conducive to the operation, in a surface environment that didn't offer lots of choices. Now many wells can be drilled from one pad, and that eases the footprint and surface damage. Further, directional drills can become horizontal drills which more effectively drain tight pools and such.

Rigrat, Your incredible data no doubt comes from incredible sources? I would imagine that after 20 odd years in the oil industry you are aware that a lot is covered up?...a lot of the data is fined tuned to accomodate whoever or whomever may need it. You work in the oilfields and have never heard of a fish hook well? Have you heard of multi-laterals? Or ERD wells?

The pro's of a land rig versus an offshore rig are much better than the con's, the obvious point I am trying to make is pollution in the water versus on land. Do you believe that if you have an offshore rig, jackup, semi or platform, that it is going to be cheaper than a land rig?
It depends on the formation they would be drilling but they could use a push the bit RSS instead of a point the bit RSS to drill a fishook well. At the end of the day there are a lot of tangibles and we are just throwing stakes into the fire here. No one knows if they intend to drill, where or how.
Personally I would much rather like to see a SantaFe, H&P or Cliffs land rig with a few thousand horses drilling on land than a Chinese jack up at sea..

Amen to all of that. Unfortunately man destroys everything he touches and about all we can do is try to do as little damage as possible as we stumble around. The only exception seems to be the American Indian tribes who lived for thousands of years with out destroying anything. This was up until about 150 or less years ago when progress came. By the late 1800's they had killed or captured all the real owners of the land and industrialization and real progress was able to flourish. Sad to think only 150 years have passed and we have filled the ocean with plastic and polluted our lakes and rivers and the air we breath. Now we have made it so the people from the Gulf cannt even eat the fish from the sea which is a right granted by God
I am doing what I can on as many fronts as I can. Most of my battles I am fighting in San Pedro because it is the frontline and the degradation of the environment is affecting us all. It has been brought about only in the last 4-5 years as a result of our current Town Council not complying with the Master Plan. Before that we had a more or less stable situation. The Master Plan called for an orderly development making sure municipal services were in place. Of course that did not happen, not because of greed from local folks but greed by big foreign investors and the govt jumping in bed with them. Fortunately because of careful husbandry Hol Chan is in good shape. Thats after we had to stop the cruise ship visitors from coming. We need all the help we can get as we are fighting the Town Board, Minister of Tourism and the meaningless DOE as well as who ever is Minister of Lands depending on the party in power. It seems to have been going on since Dito Juan.
I read the other board a couple of times and when I saw statements that were so counter-intuitive and the way anyone with an opposing view was shouted down I had to research as I absolutely hate to be factually wrong and just hate to see people bullied.
My first inclination was that this group was on BP international payroll doing PR as they seemed uninterested in any real dialogue and BP does have a huge internet PR program. Rig has said he does not work for BP currently and I accept that. Does look like he knows where his bread is buttered though.
I am much less opposed to oil companies than he may think. I own stock in offshore service industry sector which I am holding.
It should be an easy compromise. Allow drilling MOST places but not in particularly sensitive areas. That would include all offshore Belize. Its not like were sitting on the biggest oil reserve in the world and none off us sees much benefit from the existing operations.
San Pedro contributes several hundred million dollars to the GOVT annually in taxes. We receive back a subvention of $69,000 annually and have 1/2 the national average of police per person. We also receive none of the Works budget. There is a chance the roads they are driving on was paid for by San Pedro Town as are their police.
We are sitting on the largest barrier reef in the hemisphere and home to 3 of the only 4 atolls in this hemisphere. GLOBALlY UNIQUE. I would think there were other places less sensitive that could be explored. Its not like the amount of oil we could possibly produce would even be noticed on the world market. Drill everywhere seems to be a non-compromising all or nothing type position. Rig's contention that oil does not damage coral is ridiculous and cannot be supported. We cannot put our lives on pause while the reef renews itself.
Tourism has pulled Belize out of the dark ages. A large amount of that is because of our reef and fishing. Sustainable ecotourism development requires careful planning and there is much more expertise in private sector than public sector. There will always be compromise as there is no zero impact development. The govts eagerness to accommodate developers regardless of any environmental concerns is a slippery slope. The impacts of Precedent are never considered and San Pedro and North Ambergris Caye have received more than our fair share of this tragedy and dont want another.
Rather than criticizing they could please join the fight to make change happen. The govt attitude toward development is a dangerous path and is an indication of their attitude toward petroleum exploration. Dont think of the impacts of one well think of the impact of 50 or more wells. It would seem inevitable that there be some problem probably based on human factor.
This whole business of tourism/oil company is the pot calling the kettle black. We all need to work together to protect our environment. The cycle of "he did it so why cannt I" must be stopped.
Rig's stubborn attitude seems to reflect the same attitude as the human conflict that lead to the Gulf tragedy. He seems willing to twist anything to fit his view. That seems also to be the case of some companies in the Gulf as well as they play a most interesting blame game.
Oh yeah, Rig has 35 years in the petroleum industry and 10 years running his own hotel.

Multi-laterals yes, what category are you talking about?
ERD wells yes, Personally drilled many of them, and at one time my team held the world record. Not 20 years in the oil business, but over 35. And no, I am not aware that a lot is covered up. What is covered up and where?
Fish hook wells? Now why in the world would you drill out to sea from land, steer the well around and come back uner the land again. You don't actually have a clue do you?


Shallow water Jack up rigs and swamp barge rigs for vertical hole drilling are cheaper than large horsepower onshore rigs that drill horizontal wells.


Well shows how little you know then Santa Fe has not existed as a drilling company since around 2000. Helmerich and Payne's rigs are mainly 1500 horsepower and I certainly wouldn't hire one of those to drill an ERD well. They have got about 15 rigs in the 2-3000 hp range that might do the job, but I don't know if a single one would be able to handle XT 57 pipe. Those rigs are all more expensive than a swamp barge rig.
And Cliffs Drilling? Ok now I know you are full of it. They haven't even existed since the mid nineties, and even R&B that bought them doesn't exist any more.
Then more bullshit seeps to the surface.
Have you been desperately searching the internet for industry buzzwords, and then stringing them together to try and sound knowledgeable?
Maybe you worked as a roustabout ten years ago, maybe you have a friend in the oil patch, but I don't think it will be wise to try and mamaguy someone who lives eats and shits this sort of stuff every single day.